Your father's name is one of the first names I remember hearing as I started learning about the quote-unquote other side because my dad was part of a group called Jews for a Just Peace in Vancouver, and they invited Mati to come and speak.

And of course, the Jewish community center would not allow them to hold the event there.

And it was controversial that he was bringing him.

But my dad was trying to say to

people look if you have this stalwart of the zionist movement this military hero telling you

that the plo should be taken seriously and negotiated with and that these territories it's not even

an interest Israel's interest to keep them and try to annex and settle them, then what are you doing?

And of course, no one wanted to hear it.

But yeah.

Yeah.

So I tell the story and I'm glad you added that because that's kind of, so I was already

used to people in my family being, you know, consider traitors and hated and not accepted

by the establishment.

So, you know, of course,

I took it much further. He was a staunch Zionist till his dying day. I reject Zionism completely.

But it's, you know, Israelis don't want to have this conversation. So even when I am, when I am there,

I rarely meet Israelis.

I mean, I was with my family and then, or I used to be with my family,

and then I would be with my Palestinian, you know, friends and comrades, you know, doing things.

Right.

And so that was it.

I was interviewed a couple of times by Israeli news channels for all kinds of programs about, you know,

...