Welcome to Animal Spirits, a show about markets, life and investing.

Join Michael Batnick and Ben Carlson as they talk about what they're reading, writing, and watching.

Michael Batnick and Ben

were for Ritalts wealth management.

All opinions expressed by Michael and Ben or any podcast guests are solely their own opinions are subject to

change based on market and other conditions and factors and do not reflect the

opinion of Riddhol's wealth management, State Street Global Advisors and or State Street

corporations and its affiliates. This podcast is for

informational purposes only and should not be relied upon for investment

decisions. Clients of Redhol's wealth management may maintain positions in

the securities discussed in this podcast. We are sitting here with Matthew Bardellini, head of Spider America research at State Street

Global Advisors to talk about his 20-20 outlook, everything that's going on in the 60-40 portfolio and how to think about

asset allocation going forward. This is something Michael and I have been thinking

about for a long time both on the podcast and in our daily life is people have

this idea of a diversified portfolio, 60-40 is the

benchmark everyone uses and because interest rates are so low there has to be

an alternative and everyone keeps trying to figure out what that is and you go through some alternatives in your outlook piece, but talk about some of the pros and cons of finding alternative because as far as we're concerned, it's really difficult to do at this point.

Yeah, I mean, in the piece we talked about the idea of the 6040 portfolio of that diversified mix of assets of stocks and bonds,

growth assets and defensive assets.

That works.

It's the diversification between those two.

But what we have now is an environment where our return expectations are going to be lower,

...