Hey, this is the moment. I'm Brian Kaupelman. Thanks for listening. My guest today is my

pal, Stephen Heiden. He is one of the really excellent writers about music in the world.

Today, that doesn't mean I agree with him on his musical takes. But I do agree with the general

notion that writing about music with the kind of commitment, focus, intensity, and intelligence

that Stephen does is essential to how I like to live. I love engaging with thoughtful

critiques or celebrations of music and Stephen's essential reading for me. I've read him for a long

time. We both wrote for Grant Land for a period of time. He did in a more formal way and longer.

Then I, he's written a number of books. I have read most of them. Your favorite band is killing me.

Twilight of the Gods, a journey to the end of classic rock, hard to handle, which is Steve

Gorman's book and Steve's been on. But it was written with Stephen, which is the book about

the Black Croson. I have to say, it's an outstanding book. He also wrote, this isn't happening. Radio

heads kid A in the beginning of the 21st century, which it's my own fault. It's nobody else's fault,

but I'm not a radio head fan. So I didn't read that one. His new book is Long Road, Pearl Jam

and the soundtrack of a generation. It's terrific. Obviously, I am somebody who cares about Pearl Jam.

And so I was really eager to engage with that book. So Stephen, thanks for being here, man.

That was such a nice introduction that I am expecting you now to ambush me about my Jason

Isbel list. I feel like this is all an excuse for you to publicly shame me for my Jason Isbel Rockings.

Well, of course, I much prefer privately shaming you about those things, because I want to talk

about Isbel and why he rewards that kind of consideration. And I want to talk about why we care

so much about this stuff. And I want to ask you about that in a minute. Really, I guess we can

sort of start in this place. Also, I should say, you're still at uprox. You still write about

music for uprox. Yes, yeah, I've been there six years. And you host a few different. Tell

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