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Best of the Spectator

Spectator Out Loud: James Heale, William Atkinson, David Shipley, Angus Colwell and Aidan Hartley

Best of the Spectator

The Spectator

News Commentary, News, Daily News, Society & Culture

4.4785 Ratings

🗓️ 6 October 2025

⏱️ 27 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

On this week’s Spectator Out Loud: James Heale says that, for Labour, party conference was a ‘holiday from reality’; William Atkinson argues that the ‘cult of Thatcher’ needs to die; David Shipley examines the luxury of French prisons; Angus Colwell provides his notes on swan eating; and, Aidan Hartley takes listeners on a paleoanthropological tour from the Cradle of Mankind. 


Produced and presented by Patrick Gibbons.


Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Transcript

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0:00.0

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0:50.2

Hello and welcome to Spectator Out Loud, where each week we choose some of our favourite pieces from the magazine and ask their writers to read them aloud. I'm Patrick Gibbons

0:54.0

and on this week's podcast, James Heel says that Labour's conference in Liverpool was a holiday from reality.

1:00.0

William Atkinson argues that the Tories must free themselves from the cult of Thatcher.

1:04.0

With the news that the former President of France, Nicholas Sarkozy, is likely going to prison,

1:09.0

David Shipley examines the luxury of French prisons.

1:13.2

Angus Colwell reads his notes on swan eating.

1:17.2

And finally, Aidan Hartley takes us on a palaeoanthropic tour from the cradle of mankind.

1:24.3

Up first, James Heel.

1:26.2

The Labour Conference, Liverpool, was a curiously upbeat affair. Much of the good spirit came from Schoenfreude at the misadventures of Andy Burnham. The Mayor of Greater Manchester scuttled out of Liverpool just before Kirstama's speech, having united the party in mutual contempt at his posturing in recent days. A fucking clown was the verdict of an ex-Cabinet minister. He did an Eric Heffer, remarked one Labour official, a reference to the cantankerous Liverpool MP who stormed out of Neil Kinnock's conference speech 40 years ago. It was the worst coup attempt since South Korea, says a former aide. Burnham, however, is merely a symptom, not a cause of Labour's woes. Serious rivals are unlikely to telegraph their ambitions quite so blatantly. Starmer knows that the question of his leadership is unlikely to disappear. His model for re-election is his Australian counterpart, the Labour Prime Minister Anthony Albanese, who appeared on the first day of the conference. Labour thinking is straightforward, frame the next election as a presidential contest and beat the populist right, with the humble left-wing grafter. Stama's problem is that others take

2:17.9

inspiration from elsewhere. Some look to Canada, where the unpopular Justin Trudeau was axed before

2:22.2

the election, allowing Mark Carney to present the liberals to a refreshed political force.

2:26.2

Others look at America, where the failure to remove Joe Biden swiftly condemned the Democrats.

2:30.8

Stama's cabinet clapped vigorously from the front road as conference speech, but are privately wracked with doubts. Much of the frustration comes from the constant chop and change of political strategy. I agree with what Keir said today, says one MP afterwards in the bar of the conference's main hotel, but who's to say we don't change course, just like island of strangers? The Prime Minister's aide spent much of the summer working on his hour-long speech. One likens the drafting of the six and a half thousand word exercise to test cricket. It finds you out. Meanwhile, Lucy Powell has nailed on to win the Deputy Leadership race in three weeks' time, a fact acknowledged even by supporters of Bridget Philipson. Powell's expected triumph is not down to any great strategy on her behalf, other than not being the preferred candidate to number 10.

3:27.0

Lucy was the one cabinet minister he properly sacked last month, points out an older MP, and now the membership has voted to restore her. What does that say about his judgment? It is a critique that was echoed in the bars and fringe events by increasingly assertive new MPs. After a torrid 15 months, they are less inclined to give the leadership the benefit of the doubt. Some complain about the newly revamped Wips office, now stuffed with close allies of Morgan McSweeney,

4:31.2

the number 10 chief of staff. Then there is the budget where Rachel Reeves must find another 30 billion to restore her fiscal headroom. Extending the freeze on the income tax threshold could cover a third of this figure, but tax rises elsewhere are inevitable. In Starmer's conference speech, he acknowledged the impact of his tax changes on business, telling the private sector, we asked a lot of you, but few corporate types expect relief. That said, one idea under consideration of the Resolution Foundation's proposal to raise income tax while reducing national insurance. That would shift the burden from employers onto the workers. Gambling taxes are set to rise at the urging of Gordon Brown. The former Prime Minister's latest crusade is set to be motivated by high moral principle. There's some suspect there is an element of New Labour psychodrama too. Michael Dugger, his former aide, now runs the Betting and Gaming Council and will lead the charge against Baron's tax demands. Among the gloomiest attendees at conference were the Welsh Labour mob. Half the party's sitting members of the Senate are standing down May, ahead of an expected bloodbath at the election. For a hundred years, Labour has won every devolved and general election in Wales. Now, Stammer is on course to come third. Stop reform doesn't work when you've got another choice in implied, argues one aid, and other complaints that the attitude of Westminster colleagues evokes Lord Farkwad that a diminutive tyrant in TREC. Some of you may die, but it's a sacrifice that I'm willing to make. Hanging over all of this is the single greatest question of British politics. How do you stop Nigel Farage? It was left to David Lammy, the newly anointed Lord Chancellor, to offer the perfect encapsulation of the progressive dilemma. I'm not going to play the man, I'm playing the ball. He grandly told broadcasters, five seconds for accusing Farage of having flirted with Hitler youth. A retraction follows shortly thereafter. Within informed, such remarks are being used as motivational fuel ahead of May. Next month's budget, with all its various tax horrors, it is expected, in the words of one reformer to only serve as rocket boosters. For now, the movie among ministers is, let's make Keir work, as one special

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