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Radio Atlantic

Should You Be Having More Babies?

Radio Atlantic

The Atlantic

Politics, News, Society & Culture

4.41.9K Ratings

🗓️ 10 July 2025

⏱️ 30 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

In the United States and many other Western countries, the decision to have children or not is sometimes framed as a political affiliation: You’re either in league with conservative pronatalists, or you’re making the ultimate personal sacrifice to reduce your carbon footprint. But the declining global birth rate is a fact that defies politics. Dean Spears, a co-author of the new book After the Spike: Population, Progress, and the Case for People, hopes to start a conversation about what a depopulated future might look like, why we should try to avoid it, and how to make the case for more people without undoing social progress.  Get more from your favorite Atlantic voices when you subscribe. You’ll enjoy unlimited access to Pulitzer-winning journalism, from clear-eyed analysis and insight on breaking news to fascinating explorations of our world. Atlantic subscribers also get access to exclusive subscriber audio in Apple Podcasts. Subscribe today at theAtlantic.com/listener. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0

I'm Carla Lally Music, cookbook author, and snack enthusiast.

0:04.0

Do you have a sweet tooth?

0:05.3

Tune in to Sweets Unratt, a new podcast from Ferreiro and Atlantic Rethink,

0:09.6

the Atlantic's Creative Marketing Studio, where I dive into the stories behind America's favorite treats.

0:33.1

There are those who would have us believe that having babies, or not having babies, is a political act, something that transmits your allegiance to one cultural movement or another.

0:42.6

On the right, J.D. Vance wants, quote, more babies in the United States, while Elon Musk does his part, personally, to answer the call.

0:48.4

Charlie Kirk, a Turning Point USA, said this to an audience of young conservative women. We have millions of young women that are miserable. You know the most, the most miserable and depressed people in

0:55.7

America are career-driven early 30-something women. It's not my numbers, it's the peer research

1:01.8

numbers. They're most likely to say that they're upset, they're depressed, they're in antidepressants.

1:06.9

Do you know who the happiest women in America are? Married women with lots of children. By far.

1:12.5

Meanwhile, on the political left and elsewhere, people agonize about whether to have children at all.

1:19.3

For environmental reasons or money reasons, or I just don't want to spend my time that way reasons.

1:25.3

Get ready with me when I tell you all the reasons but I don't want to have kids.

1:28.3

I want to spend my money on what I want to spend my money on.

1:30.6

I don't want another human life dictating what I'm going to do.

1:34.0

I think you are absolutely crazy to have a baby

1:37.0

if you're living in America right now.

1:38.8

Some of us aren't having kids because we can't justify

1:40.9

bringing them into this type of world. How are we going to have children and we can't even afford ourselves?

1:46.2

But if you move the discussion outside politics and into just sheer demographics,

1:51.5

how many humans ideally do we want on earth?

1:55.2

A whole different conversation is beginning,

...

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