Welcome to the History Extra podcast, fascinating historical conversations from the makers of BBC History Magazine.

What was it like to undergo an operation in a world with no anaesthetic? How was the stethoscope invented?

And when did we first operate on a human heart?

In her new book, Dr. Carol Cooper condenses the history of medicine

down to the stories of 12 pivotal objects,

from the bone sore to the heart-lung machine.

Lauren Good spoke to Carol to find out more. And please be aware, the following podcast does

contain descriptions of medical and mental health issues. Carol, thank you for joining me to explore

your new book, The History of Medicine in 12

Objects. Let's start with a question I know I was asking when I started reading this book.

How on earth did you begin narrowing down this expansive history to the 12 objects we'll be

talking about today? Hi, Lauren. Well, it was not an easy task and I really wanted to make it

about 20 objects, but then I realized I wouldn't be able to devote as many words, as much space

if I did that. So I really had to narrow it down to 12. But I think each of the objects, I go through

the antecedents to that object on what came before

and also how the object was used, how it was received to my fellow professionals and patients,

and what it led to afterwards.

So, for example, the x-ray machine leads on to other improvements in imaging and actually new ways of doing surgery.

I'm going to attempt to touch on all the objects as you do so brilliantly in the book. First,

the trefine, which many will see as a somewhat barbaric tool used to make a hole in the head.

Why has it made the list? It was one of the first surgical instruments ever.

And of course, what's really awesome is how did the idea come about? And how did people stay still

...