Hello there. This is Mark Bauerline with another conversation. Before we get to it, a word about one of our sponsors.

You may have seen a recent article in Inside Higher Ed.com that began, Wyoming Catholic College has a lot of

unusual things about it, each enough to merit a story in itself.

Wyoming Catholic is a conservative Catholic college that educates students in the great books and Catholic tradition.

It also teaches horsemanship and banned cell phones on campus.

I love that.

And it turned down federal funding.

President Glenn Arbery describes the mission this way.

This college is engaged in deep ways

with the agony of a culture that has lost its spiritual center. We're adventurous and poetic

and deeply Catholic. He likes to cite Dostoevsky in crime and punishment. Low ceilings

are bad for the soul. The ceilings rise at Wyoming Catholic, which is located in the foothills of the

Wind River Mountains, the curriculum centers in the Western tradition. Its Catholic identity

builds upon Thomas Aquinas and the Magisterium of the Catholic Church and engaging with God

in the wilderness. Find out more at Wyoming Catholic.edu. We have with us Jonathan O'Brien. He's an attorney in New York City,

and he has filed a lawsuit in the state of Nevada that I think first things readers, listeners,

ought to hear about. Welcome, Mr. O'Brien. It's nice to be here. I believe this is my first

podcast ever. Well, I'm going to try to make a good first

impression on you. Thank you. Let's go. Okay. Now, I have the document of the lawsuit in front of me

that I received a couple of weeks ago, but why don't you tell us exactly what laws have the defendants in this lawsuit broken?

And what contracts have they violated?

Well, that's a good question because everyone wants to get out of Pat and Pencil,

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