Sammy, one of the things, and we're going to get right into it, is most people what they want to hear told is they want to hear, you kept the life and you valued the life, and you always sort of kept that thing, cosonostra, that's koshenostra, you know, that's our thing.

And you always kept that close to your heart.

Yet people want to know what made

you then cooperate. Wow, that's that's a hell of a story. It's on my podcast. You know, all my life,

as you guys know, I've been busted all my life. I've been asked to cooperate a hundred times. I never did.

When I went to prison with John Gotti in 1990, he really didn't want to go to prison.

And it was the worst 11 months I've did out of the 22 years I've been in prison.

And he was really horrible to do time with. You know, Jerry Capici a little while ago called me up and he said, I did a interview

with F. Lee Bailey, just the other day. Now, I didn't get along too much with F. Lee Bailey, and I don't think he liked me

too much either, but this is what the guy said in his interview. He said, when the lawyers were

restricted, who could represent us, who can't. We called him in. He's a good lawyer. There's no

question about it.

And he said to John, he said, John, you're admitting these things and talking about Sammy and Frankie on the tapes.

You can't beat this case.

What I suggest is that you take a plea.

John looked at him and said,

I got an ace in the hole.

I'm going to throw Sammy and Frankie Lacassio under the bus.

I'm going to throw the weight on them, and I'm going to beat the case.

Flee Bell, he said, when John told him that he left the room and never came back.

He didn't want any part of doing that.

He didn't want any part of the case.

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