Sam Smith: what’s the problem with ‘them’?

Beyond Today

BBC

News

4.6 • 1.1K Ratings

🗓️ 17 September 2019

⏱️ 26 minutes

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Summary

Over the weekend the singer Sam Smith released a statement which read: “I’ve decided I am changing my pronouns to THEY/THEM.” Coming from a pop artist who has sold over 20m records, this felt like a moment where non-binary hit the mainstream. Sam’s post sparked a debate about gender, identity and language. Tom Rasmussen is a drag queen, writer and actor who identifies as non-binary, and Sam Smith credited Tom for helping them understand what it is to be this. We invited Tom into the Beyond Today studio to talk about pronouns, Celine Dion, and the trickiest conversations they’ve had with their mum. Producers: Lucy Hancock and Alicia Burrell Mixed by Nicolas Raufast Editor: John Shields

Transcript

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0:00.0	BBC Sounds, music radio podcasts.
0:04.6	Hello, I'm Tina Dehealey.
0:08.7	This is Beyond Today from BBC Radio 4,
0:11.9	a space to ask one big question about one big story.
0:15.0	Today, what's the problem with them?
0:27.0	Singer Sam Smith released a statement over the weekend. It read, I've decided I'm changing my
0:38.1	pronouns to they slash them. After a lifetime of being at war with my gender, I've decided to embrace myself
0:46.0	for who I am, inside and out.
0:50.2	For a pop artist who's sold over 20 million records, this feels like a moment where non-binary has properly hit the mainstream.
0:58.0	On the day of that announcement, Google searches for the term increased by 550%. But conversations
1:05.6	around gender identity always seem to kick up fierce reactions.
1:10.3	I'm a penguin. Ident a two-spirit penguin.
1:15.0	Everyone happy with that?
1:17.0	Yes, I'm perfectly happy with you.
1:18.0	Two-spirited that.
1:19.0	Gender- Gender- Gender Fluid Pem-Penguin. That was a predictable reaction from Peers Morgan, but for lots of people this does
1:29.7	feel like new territory and these kinds of conversations around identity and
1:34.0	crucially language can get a bit intense. Today we're speaking to someone who's
1:39.2	been on the receiving end. I'm Tom Rasmussen but better known to my fans as Crystal Rasmussen and by fans I mean my mom.
1:47.0	I'm a singer-dancer model actress.
1:50.0	And a writer of Dirty Songs.
1:53.0	A K
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