This is Jenny Allen and you are listening to The Made for This Podcast.

Welcome back to another episode of the Made for this podcast. We're so grateful for our

friends at Ishu for partnering with us for this episode. You can get started

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ISSU.com. And use our promo code made for this. And now here's Jenny. Well, you guys, this is going to be a treat for me. This is going to be a treat for you.

Because this is one of our most popular guests we have ever had at If Gathering, but also on

the podcast. If you have not listened to his first episode you've got to go back and listen to it because it's a high level of what we're going to do today on shame and it is Dr. Kurt Thompson. He is in the house. We are so excited to have him I know this

Kurt makes me cry every time we talk Kurt makes me cry so I'm hoping for a day

That I don't cry and that y'all don't cry but you know

Kurt it's kind of your specialty I know my

mission I'm see he even he's excited about it right I am I'm looking forward to

about 10 minutes from now I'm looking for about 10 minutes now that it's all going to it's all going to come out.

See I basically pay for or I get free counseling by podcasting you know I just just get awesome people on to help me.

Yeah, and it's free.

Believe you me.

Yeah, he's like, Jenny, if I'll make you cry, you're paying me.

Okay, well, here's what I know. I know this, that there are issues in our day right now and this is what we're talking about this season, Kurt, is we all find ourselves in a very, very difficult chaotic fall.

And we are fighting all kinds of feelings.

And some of those feelings, for a lot of people,

it's the first time that they're really waking up to them

and noticing them. I doubt it's the first time that they're really waking up to them and noticing them. I doubt it's

the first time they're feeling them. But I want to discuss a little bit about shame

...