Unless the measuring rod is independent of the things measured, we can do no measuring.

C.S. Lewis, the poison of subjectivism.

This is Pints with Jack, season 5, episode 45.

The Moral Argument. After Hours with Trent Horn.

Good. argument. After Hours with Trent Horn. Good morning, everyone. Pineswood Jack is your

favorite weekly C.S. Lewis podcast, where David, Andrew, and I break down and discuss the

works of C.S. Lewis. This season, we've been talking about love, and we worked our way through Lewis's book

The Four Loves. We then had Ecumenism Month, where David spoke to people from diverse

religious backgrounds who love Lewis. We are now in apologetics month, where we will be examining

some of Lewis's favorite arguments for theism in Christianity. And today,

I am speaking to Trent Horn about the moral argument. Trent serves as a staff apologist for

Catholic Answers. He has a master's degree in the fields of theology, philosophy, and bioethics.

Trent runs a podcast of the Council of Trent.

For those with church history will know, the pun on that spelled a little bit different counsel.

He published many books such as counterfeit Christ's persuasive pro-life,

made this way how to prepare kids to face today's tough moral issues, and answering theism,

one that I have read, why we're Catholic, and I give it to many, many people. And he's a

returning guest to the podcast. So Trent Horn, welcome to Pints with Jack. Thank you so much for

having me. Well, I'm excited this episode because we plan out these seasons many, many, many months in advance.

And David is the organized one. And he put together everything. And he asked if I would do this one

because he knows mere Christianity, the beginning part, is a lot of this moral argument. And it's one

that I don't want to say I wasn't convinced with,

...