you

Hello and welcome. You're tuned into the best in Paranormal Talk radio. This is beyond

the darkness. I'm Dave. That's Tim. All right, Tim. You've always had a fascination in

this. I know I've given you tons of books from different authors that have passed these

along to me. Secret societies. Why do you think people are so fascinated by secret societies?

You know, I think people have a fascination with the fact that they think their lives are so

out of control and that people are ruling them from the outside that they can't... They

essentially, Dave, they feel like they can't get control of their own lives and that other

people must be responsible for the fact that they can't control them. That there's such a

lack of control on their own part that there has to be... There just has to be something else

out there that's steering them the other way. So you don't believe that there are these clentestine

organizations of people that are together running and ruling parts of the world and manipulating behind

the scenes. I find it hard to believe. Really? I do. You're the one that was touting out J.Z. He was part of

the Illuminati. What are you doing? I find it funny because you know why and we'll get into it with Nick

Redfern here a little bit later. But I find it funny that an organization that supposedly has

ties to Europe and I'll even go so far as to say central white Europe that all of a sudden they're

inclusive of J.Z. and other races and to supposedly keep themselves alive. I find it's funny

that the narrative changes throughout different generations to supposedly keep themselves alive.

I think people adapt the story in order to make it fit into the narrative of that particular generation.

All right. Well, yeah, I'm fascinated by it. I mean, are there these groups and organizations that

can fast track your life, fast track your career or can gum up the works? Nick Redfern is the guy I

want to turn to has got a new book called Secret Societies, the Complete Guide to histories,

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