***THEME MUSIC***

Hello and welcome you're tuned into the best in paranormal talk radio this is beyond the darkness

I'm your host Dave Schrader.

I think it's been about five or six years since we've had our guests down the show and

fascinating guy and kicking myself or not having brought him back sooner but this seems

like the perfect time he released a book this past February called Black Swan Ghosts

a sociologist encounters witnesses to unexplained aerial craft their occupants and other elements

of the multiverse and he poses the question what happens when you come into contact with

a phenomenon so controversial that it can destroy your career.

So Black Swan Ghosts is an investigation into how our society treats witnesses to unexplained

events unidentified aerial objects and mysterious beings.

So joining us now after way too long a time Dr. Simian Heine, Dr. Heine thank you for joining

us.

Yeah thanks a lot Dave thanks for having me again.

Great great topic and concept for this book let's start with a little bit of your background

for listeners that are new and and coming on to us and just finding the show talk to me

a little bit about your background and into this research how you got involved.

Well initially started with a kind of a conventional background like you know in college graduate

school you know assistant professorships and stuff like that and you know I just thought

I was going to go into academics and you know get a PhD and teach and you know do the

things that you were taught to do were so conditioned from the time we're really small right

right it starts in kindergarten they they get you in kindergarten telling you with this

...