Hi, this is Chris McGregor. Before we begin, I want to let you know that Disserting Hearts needs your help.

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Discerninghearts.com, in cooperation with the Oblates of the Virgin Mary, presents

struggles in the spiritual life, their nature and their remedies, with Father Timothy Gallagher.

Father Gallagher is the author of many best-selling books on the theology and spirituality of St. Ignatius of Loyola.

He holds the St. Ignatius' chair of spiritual formation at St. John

Theological Seminary in Denver, Colorado. Struggles in the spiritual life, their nature and their

remedies with Father Timothy Gallagher. I'm your host, Chris McGregor. Welcome back, Father Gallagher.

Oh, thank you once again, Chris.

We are on the spiritual journey,

and we're beginning to make some friends

in the stories that you've told us

about Bob and Julie and Kathy and several others,

and what should become apparent now to those who are with us on this

journey is that everybody is experiencing something. It's never where I'm over this hump

and I'll never have spiritual desolation again or I'll never have the struggles again. In reality, you can almost

count that some struggles will continue to pop up. Sure. Yeah, that's just part of everything human

and certainly our spiritual experience as well. Now, the reason why we continue to speak about one struggle after another

...