Welcome to Hard Talk on the BBC World Service with me, Stephen Sacker. My guest today is a man of faith

whose Christian beliefs have taken him on an extraordinary journey, making enemies of former friends

and unearthing new allies in unexpected places. Rob Schenck was raised in a non-observant Jewish household, but as a young adult, he felt a calling

to the Christian ministry.

He became an evangelical pastor and one of America's most prominent and radical young

anti-abortion activists, leading mass protests outside abortion clinics and

forging close links with prominent social conservative politicians in Washington, D.C.

Things changed when he confronted social conservatism's passionate opposition to gun control

in America. Minister Schenck reached out to victims of gun violence

and broke with many of his erstwhile Christian conservative friends. That led him to question the

tight embrace between the evangelical movement and the Republican right. Some in the movement have

called him a traitor, particularly as he's now

vocal in his opposition to Donald Trump's re-election. So is he an outlier or an emblem of Trump-era

fragmentation within America's religious right? Well, the Reverend Rob Schenck joins me now on the line

from Washington, D.C. Welcome to Hard Talk. Reverend Rob Schenck joins me now on the line from Washington, D.C. Welcome to Hard Talk.

Reverend Rob Schenck in Washington, D.C. Welcome to Hard Talk. Thank you. A privilege to be with you.

We're delighted to have you and to hear about a pretty extraordinary spiritual journey you have been on. Can I start by asking you to tell me who you feel

yourself to be today? Are you still a socially conservative evangelical minister?

Yes, I would certainly define myself that way. It's still my role. I have leadership capacities

in that identity with denominations, with various church bodies, organizations. I had an

organization that is largely made up of Christian allies. But I consider myself these days more, I suppose,

you might call it a recovering member of the religious right. I've had a big change in my life,

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