Hello and welcome to the TIFO football podcast. I'm Joe Devine and today I'm delighted to be joined by John McKenzie.

Hello Joe. All right John, how's it going? Good, thank you. How are you? I'm good. Thanks, man. Now, what are we doing on today's episode? We're doing ring for analysis.

Very exciting, audio exclusive, of course.

And today is very special because it's part one of a two-part special Ring for Analysis episode mini-series.

All about Brian Clough.

And it was written by Daniel Taylor and actually published in 2019 on The Athletic.

So we're digging deep into the archives.

We're digging very deep into the archives.

This was actually, this was and remains my favourite ever, the Athletic article.

I love it.

It's a terrific story.

The headline is The Remarkable Tale of Two Boys Who Went Begging for Pennings and and ended up living with Brian Clough.

Yes, John. I want to ring for analysis before we've even got there.

Well, before you do that, can you just explain what ring for analysis is and what that bell they just heard was?

Well, before I get to that, let me just say, when you said the athletic, I've learned all kinds of things from having to go through the process of editing my book. One of which is that often you don't put the the, really? So at least in footnotes. It was a telegraph article. It was a Z telegraph article. It will just say telegraph, not V. So I don't need to say it was a the athletic article. This thing will blow your mind even more.

Right.

The rules for the publishing house that I'm at have a rule where you italicize the name of the

publication if it's a written publication.

But not if it's visual.

If it's digital only.

So if it's like, so the athletic in my footnotes is not italicized, but the Times or the New York Times would be italicized because... That's filthy. They're going to have to change that rule. It's weird, isn't it? It feels as though I feel disrespected because that makes me feel like TIFO wouldn't be italicized. It wouldn't. But it should be. You think it should?

Maybe we need to publish something written.

...