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BiggerPockets Real Estate Podcast

Retired in His Mid-40s Using the Perfect “Small” Rental Property Formula

BiggerPockets Real Estate Podcast

BiggerPockets

Education, Business, Investing

4.816.5K Ratings

🗓️ 3 December 2025

⏱️ 37 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

How does a 9th-grade dropout end up retiring early in his 40s with over 50 rental properties that generate the highest possible cash flow?  And we’re not talking about big properties—no apartment buildings or commercial real estate. This investor built the perfect rental property portfolio from duplexes and triplexes—small multifamily properties that any new investor can buy. Instead of taking his energy and buying larger properties, he reinvested in the ones he had, which made him even more money, allowing him to scale faster. Matt (the Lumberjack Landlord) and his wife have self-managed over 100 rental units, meaning all that cash flow goes to them. Using his “acquire, stabilize, optimize” formula, Matt’s rentals make hundreds more in cash flow per unit than other properties. This has allowed him to retire in his 40s, all while supporting his family of six. Today, he’s showing you how you can make the most from your rental properties, too. Simple utility changes, smart renovations for higher rents, cheap (and efficient) upgrades, and more can put hundreds of dollars back in your pocket every month. Plus, he shares how to keep your best tenants, even during tough economic times. If Matt could do it all while working 60+ hour weeks, why can’t you? In This Episode We Cover How to make the most cash flow possible by self-managing your rentals  Bigger isn’t better: Why Matt exclusively buys small multifamily properties  The “formula” for the rental portfolio that can retire you in your 40s  How to afford your first rental property even if you’re low on cash  Why every investor should talk to local banks first about financing their rentals  Easy ways to keep your best tenants even when the economy gets shaky  Would you live in a jail? Why Matt’s tenants pay to get put behind bars  And So Much More! Check out more resources from this show on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠BiggerPockets.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.biggerpockets.com/blog/real-estate-1208 Interested in learning more about today’s sponsors or becoming a BiggerPockets partner yourself? Email ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠[email protected]⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0

If this investor can self-manage 150 units, you can manage one or five or 10.

0:06.5

Today, the lumberjack landlord is here sharing how he's built a life-changing portfolio

0:11.6

out of duplexes and triplexes, all with low vacancy and almost no tenant headaches.

0:22.9

Hey, everyone, welcome to the Bigger Pockets podcast.

0:25.9

I'm Dave Meyer, head of real estate investing at Bigger Pockets.

0:29.9

Our guest today is Matt, the lumberjack landlord.

0:32.7

Matt has built himself a really impressive portfolio that allowed him to retire early from a tech career last

0:39.4

year, but he didn't do it by scaling to bigger multifamily properties. He owns more than 50 different

0:46.0

properties, almost all of them duplexes and triplexes. In this episode, he's going to share a few

0:51.1

of the systems he's created to increase his time freedom,

0:54.1

even while consistently adding more units.

0:57.3

These include low-cost renovation ideas that can reduce your heat and water bills as much as

1:02.1

20% every month, how working with local banks to lock in favorable financing that big national

1:08.1

lenders just can't compete with.

1:10.7

And stick around to hear his

1:11.8

latest really awesome fun project converting a local jail into housing units. Let's bring on Matt.

1:19.0

Matt, welcome to the Bigger Pockets podcast. Thanks for being here. Thanks so much for having me.

1:23.3

I would like if I was telling you it wasn't a dream coming true to finally be here. Very awesome and fresh off of BPCon, which was absolutely spectacular.

1:32.3

Love hearing that. It was awesome. So much fun. Yeah. So thanks for coming to BPCon. And thank you for being here. We're excited that you're here. Maybe just start by giving us a little bit of background. How did you find yourself in real estate investing?

1:45.7

Like, where were you in life when you first started getting into it? Yeah. So me in a short description

1:52.0

is I'm a ninth grade dropout. So any room I walk into, everyone's more educated than I am.

1:57.3

Dropped out, started working every job I could, and then eventually got into software,

...

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