Remembering The CIA’s Mind Games

SpyCast

News, Education, History

4.4 • 1.6K Ratings

🗓️ 25 March 2025

⏱️ 29 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Sidney Gottlieb was one of the CIA’s star chemists during the Cold War. As head of MKUltra, he ran a brazen—and deadly—program aimed at mind control. Gottlieb and fellow scientists tried to keep the work secret by destroying files, but historian John Lisle has new details from the six boxes that remained untouched. He shares insights and reflections straight from the mouths of MKUltra’s perpetrators and victims. John’s new book, Project Mind Control, sheds light on one of the CIA’s darkest moments which still haunts the agency. Available now for pre-order. If you liked this episode, check out these links: The Dirty Tricks Department with John Lisle THE SOUND: Mystery of Havana Syndrome Subscribe to Sasha's Substack, HUMINT, to get more intelligence stories: https://sashaingber.substack.com/ And if you have feedback or want to hear about a particular topic, you can reach us by E-mail at [email protected]. This show is brought to you from Goat Rodeo, Airwave, and the International Spy Museum in Washington, DC. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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1:03.5	Welcome to Spycast, the official podcast of the International Spy Museum and the oldest spy podcast in the United States.
1:12.6	I'm your host, Sasha Inver, and each week I take you into the shadows of espionage,
1:18.4	intelligence, and covert operations across the globe.
1:25.3	Sydney Gottlie was one of the CIA's star chemists during the Cold War. As head of MK Ultra, he ran a brazen and deadly program aimed at mind control. Think experiments with sex and drugs, prisoners and mental patients, deceptions that ran deep. Years later, he was destroying files to keep the work
1:46.5	secret. Just six boxes remain. But historian John Lyle has new details, straight from the mouths
1:54.2	of M.K. Ultras perpetrators through previously unexplored depositions. His new book, Project
2:00.7	Mind Control, sheds light on one of the CIA's darkest moments, which
2:05.7	still haunts the agency.
2:09.4	Hi, John.
	...

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