meta_pixel
Tapesearch Logo
Log in
The Lawfare Podcast

Rational Security: The “Bridle and Groomed” Edition

The Lawfare Podcast

The Lawfare Institute

Military, Intelligence, International Law, Constitutional Law, Rule Of Law, Politics, International Relations, News, Government, History, Diplomacy, Terrorism, National Security, Current Events, Law, Foreign Policy

4.76.2K Ratings

🗓️ 22 May 2025

⏱️ 76 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

This week, Scott sat down with a particularly baritone cast of Lawfare colleagues—co-host emeritus Benjamin Wittes, Foreign Policy Editor Dana Stuster, and Senior Editor (aka Legal Correspondent) Roger Parloff—to discuss the week’s biggest national security news stories, including:

  • “Let’s Sheikh On It.” President Trump completed a surprisingly historic trip to the Persian Gulf last week, which began with the type of fanfare that Trump loves and only Saudi Arabia can provide and ended with the controversial gift of a new Air Force One from Qatar at the president’s reported request. In between, however, Trump reiterated his calls for an end to the Gaza conflict, became directly involved in negotiating the release of the last living American-Israeli hostage from Hamas, and announced a dramatic about-face in U.S. sanctions policy toward the new regime in Syria that caught even his closest advisers by surprise—all measures that are unlikely to be greeted warmly by the man who has traditionally been Trump’s closest regional ally, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. How big a pivot point was Trump’s trip? And what could its implications be for U.S. policy towards the region?
  • “Not Retiring from a Fight.” The Supreme Court issued an unprecedented third opinion off its emergency docket this past week in the inaptly named A.A.R.P. v. Trump, part of the ongoing litigation over the Trump administration’s controversial efforts to remove Venezuelan nationals under the Alien Enemies Act. In a 7-2 ruling, the Court held that the summary notice and opportunity to challenge that U.S. officials had provided to some individuals prior to their removal was inadequate. But as litigation through the lower courts continues, what impact is this holding likely to have on the administration’s broader immigration policies?
  • “Shell Shocked.” Former FBI Director James Comey found himself at the center of an unlikely controversy this week, when his decision to relay a photo of shells arranged to form the numbers “8647” that he reportedly found on the beach was interpreted as a death threat against President Trump, triggering a Secret Service interview and potentially more legal consequences to come. How seriously should this incident be taken? And what does it tell us about the Trump administration’s use of prosecutorial discretion?

In Object Lessons, as white smoke rose over the Vatican, Roger also turned his gaze heavenward—diving into Benjamin Blech and Roy Doliner’s “The Sistine Secrets” to uncover the subtexts Michelangelo left behind. Inspired by the same papal events, Scott turned to Conclave for a peek inside the process. Ben planted seeds of solidarity and resilience (or was that resistance?) across from the Russian embassy. And Dana’s incoming students at Franklin and Marshall College are about to share in his appreciation for Osamu Dazai’s “The Setting Sun.”

To receive ad-free podcasts, become a Lawfare Material Supporter at www.patreon.com/lawfare. You can also support Lawfare by making a one-time donation at https://givebutter.com/lawfare-institute.

Support this show http://supporter.acast.com/lawfare.


Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

The following podcast contains advertising.

0:04.4

To access an ad-free version of the Lawfare podcast, become a material supporter of Lawfare at

0:11.5

patreon.com slash lawfare. That's patreon.com slash lawfare.

0:18.2

Also, check out Lawfare's other podcast offerings, Rational Security, Chatter, Lawfare No Bull, and The Aftermath.

0:31.8

At Barclays, we run programs that help communities across the UK, whether you're a young person, gaining skills to enter the workplace,

0:40.3

a small business trying to grow and find its place in the modern world,

0:45.3

or a girl in school, building confidence on and off the pitch through football.

0:52.3

We believe everyone deserves to fly.

0:56.5

Search Barclays communities to find out more.

0:59.5

Barclays, here for every goal.

1:04.6

So guys, preekness or stash?

1:11.5

Ben,

1:12.3

getting into the meta of our B-roll conversation from the jump.

1:16.8

I mean, we've got Scott says he watched the preakness.

1:20.5

Dana is sporting the most 70s mustache I've seen in a long time.

1:26.9

Which are we talking about? We do have a bit of a facial

1:30.7

hair trend going. Why don't we start with the stash as we critiqued Ben's facial hair the last time. He

1:34.9

was on the podcast. I think it's only fair. Dana, what has inspired this very Tom Selleck vibe?

1:40.9

I was going to say, John Bolton vibe.

1:43.3

You're not wearing a Hawaiian shirt,

1:44.8

which I do think is the move that you're missing, and perhaps flying on a helicopter with a,

1:48.8

I think it was a Yankees hat was the Magnum P.I vibe. I can keep going bigger. I had a beard

...

Please login to see the full transcript.

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from The Lawfare Institute, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of The Lawfare Institute and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.

Copyright © Tapesearch 2025.