I'm Kurt Nickish, co-host of the HBR idea cast.

And besides this show, there's a growing roster of podcasts we make called

HBR Presents.

And today I want to introduce you to the newest one, Race at Work. It's hosted by Porter Braswell, the CEO of Jopwell.

The show explores how race affects careers and lives. In candid conversations, senior leaders from business and government and other fields trace their personal

journeys with race, equity, and inclusion, including what they got right and wrong.

In this episode,

Braswell speaks with Donna Johnson,

who pioneered the role of Chief Diversity Officer at Mastercard.

She shares her unique perspective and experience on how to make long-term change to company culture.

HPR presents. One Friday afternoon, several of us got together to meet with a senior executive and there were five women and one

man the man was white and the women were all women of color and we're laughing and we're enjoying the conversation

where there's a lot of energy and the door swings open and one of our executives looks in the room and raises her voice and tells us that we need to be quiet and as she proceeded to reprimand us she saw the white man in the room and stopped.

It is those small micro inequities that make a difference to the way the individual feels about your

organization. All she wanted to say was keep it down. What we heard was you people

are too loud. We are presents. This is Race at Work, the show where we explore how race affects our careers and our lives.

I'm Port of Roswell. I left a Wall Street career to start a company called Jobwell because I wanted to help Corporate America build a more diverse workforce.

Each week we talk to a different leader about their journey with race, equity, and inclusion.

These are the conversations we don't usually have at work,

but this shows a safe place to share and learn

from each other. This week my guest is Donna Johnson, former Chief Diversity

Officer at MasterCard who's now retired. For those that don't know, a Chief Diversity Officer is also known as a C. D.O.

...