Picking sharp problems, increasing virality, and unique product frameworks | Oji Udezue (Typeform, Twitter, Calendly, Atlassian)
Lenny's Podcast: Product | Growth | Career
Lenny Rachitsky
5.0 • 1.5K Ratings
🗓️ 14 September 2023
⏱️ 76 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
Brought to you by Jira Product Discovery—Atlassian’s new prioritization and roadmapping tool built for product teams
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Oji Udezue is Chief Product Officer at Typeform and has held leadership roles at Twitter (Head of Product for Creation and Conversation), Calendly (CPO), and Atlassian (Head of Product for communication tools). He is well-known for bringing a product-led-growth (PLG) mindset to the companies he joins. Additionally, Oji mentors startups, is a Managing Partner at the Kernel Fund, and writes online about product management. In this episode, we discuss:
• Oji’s “Where to Fish to Land a Unicorn” and “Zone of Benefit” frameworks
• Why you need to find the “sharpest” problem
• How to operationalize continuous customer discovery
• Tips on optimizing onboarding flows
• Freemium vs. gated offerings in PLG
• Tactical strategies for making your product more viral
• The concept of “forest time” and how it can provide clarity in your work
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Find the transcript for this episode and all past episodes at: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/episodes/. Today’s transcript will be live by 8 a.m. PT.
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Where to find Oji Udezue:
• Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/ojiudezue
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ojiudezue/
• Substack: https://substack.com/@ojiudezue
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Where to find Lenny:
• Newsletter: https://www.lennysnewsletter.com
• Twitter/X: https://twitter.com/lennysan
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lennyrachitsky/
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In this episode, we cover:
(00:00) Oji’s background
(03:38) Oji’s “Where to Fish to Land a Unicorn” framework
(05:26) Workflow quadrants
(09:30) How product people can push frequency
(12:28) Oji’s “Zone of Benefit” framework
(14:49) How to find your ICPs
(15:33) ICPs at Twitter
(20:20) Oji’s philosophy on frameworks
(22:31) Oji’s upcoming book
(24:34) An explanation of “sharp problems”
(28:31) Signs your problem is “sharp enough”
(31:17) Discovery vs. continuous conversations
(35:08) Customer listening
(38:31) Onboarding fundamentals
(43:49) Activated user milestones
(45:47) The power of network effects
(50:15) An explanation of virality and how to increase it
(56:32) How to use “forest time” to zoom out and see problems in a new way
(1:00:53) Lessons from Oji’s time at Bridgewater Associates
(1:05:07) Why R&D teams need a larger system beyond Agile and design
(1:06:57) Lightning round
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Referenced:
• Where to fish to land a unicorn: https://ojiudezue.medium.com/where-to-fish-to-land-a-unicorn-in-b2b-saas-9bc93c96152c
• Coda: https://coda.io/
• Atlassian: https://www.atlassian.com/
• Finding high-frequency customers (use cases): https://ojiudezue.medium.com/finding-high-frequency-customers-use-cases-53773a753bb5
• Evernote: https://evernote.com/
• Industry PM conference: https://www.industryconference.com/
• Typeform: https://www.typeform.com/
• Build better products with continuous product discovery | Teresa Torres: https://www.lennyspodcast.com/videos/build-better-products-with-continuous-product-discovery-teresa-torres/
• Pendo: https://www.pendo.io/
• Amplitude: https://amplitude.com/
• Dan Hockenmaier on Twitter: https://twitter.com/danhockenmaier
• Seth Godin’s blog: https://seths.blog/
• A key ritual: Forest time: https://ojiudezue.substack.com/p/a-key-ritual-forest-time
• Principles: https://www.principles.com/
• Dot Collector: https://principlesus.com/dot-collector-real-time-feedback/
• The Halo Effect: . . . and the Eight Other Business Delusions That Deceive Managers: https://www.amazon.com/Halo-Effect-Business-Delusions-Managers/dp/1476784035/
• Dune: https://www.amazon.com/Dune-Penguin-Galaxy-Frank-Herbert/dp/0143111582
• Foundation: https://www.amazon.com/Foundation-3-Book-Boxed-Set-Empire/dp/0593499573
• Foundation on AppleTV+: https://tv.apple.com/us/show/foundation/umc.cmc.5983fipzqbicvrve6jdfep4x3
• Unlox: https://unlox.it/
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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/. For inquiries about sponsoring the podcast, email podcast@lennyrachitsky.com.
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Lenny may be an investor in the companies discussed.
Get full access to Lenny's Newsletter at www.lennysnewsletter.com/subscribe
Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | products who try to be viral just for what I call synthetic virality that fail because in the end |
| 0:05.5 | if you're synthetically viral and people get to the product and it sucks that's it. |
| 0:09.5 | You know Slack wasn't even viral right there was no synthetic virality. Slack couldn't even viral, right? There was no synthetic burialics. |
| 0:13.4 | Slack couldn't even connect to organizations for the longest time. |
| 0:15.8 | You could be working on the third floor and it's all you're in Slack on the fourth floor |
| 0:19.1 | and you would have no clue. |
| 0:20.5 | There's no way to share it with them. |
| 0:21.9 | But what happens when you went to lunch, people are like, we got slack and this is amazing. And people on the third floor are like, holy shit, when can we get it? Boom, boom, boom. This is the bedrock of virality. Build a great product that solves a sharp problem. |
| 0:37.0 | Welcome to Lenny's podcast where I interview world-class product leaders and growth experts |
| 0:41.2 | to learn from their hard-won experiences building and growing today's most successful products. |
| 0:45.6 | Today my guest is A. G. Ojy Ady's way. Ajy has helped build and grow products at Microsoft. |
| 0:50.8 | We worked on Windows Outlook, Hotmail, and Inre Explorer, |
| 0:54.0 | at Atlassian, where he was head of product for all their communication tools. |
| 0:57.4 | At Tallenley, where he was Chief Product Officer. |
| 1:00.0 | At Twitter, where he was head of product for creation and conversation. |
| 1:03.6 | He's currently Chief Product Officer at Typeform, which I am a happy customer of. |
| 1:08.0 | A.G. has one of the broadest and most interesting careers in product, and he's also one of the most thoughtful humans I've met. |
| 1:14.0 | In our conversation, Audrey shares some of his favorite product frameworks and also why you should |
| 1:18.1 | be really careful applying frameworks at your company. |
| 1:20.9 | We dig into what he's learned from Callinley and at last he in a type form on how to do |
| 1:24.9 | product lead growth successfully and also how to get really sharp with your ICP or ideal customer |
| 1:30.0 | profile, also how to increase your product's virality, and a concept |
... |
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