The episode you're about to listen to was released back when the mere Christians podcast was called the call to mastery

Now if you love mere Christians, you're still going to love these older episodes because the majority of each

conversation focuses on how the gospel influences the work of our guests. With that disclaimer out of the way, please enjoy the episode.

Hey everybody, welcome to the call to mastery. I'm Jordan Rayner. This is a

podcast for Christians who want to do their most exceptional their most masterful

work for the glory of God and the good of others.

Every single week I'm hosting in a conversation with a Christian who's pursuing world-class

mastery of their craft.

We're talking about their path to mastery, we're talking about

their daily habits and routines, and how their faith influences their work.

Today I am thrilled to share this terrific conversation I recently had with Phil Corson, who's a senior

product manager at Seven Shifts. Seven Shifts is a scheduling software for restaurant managers and their staff. It's used by 350,000

restaurant employees in more than 10,000 restaurants in North America. And by the way, if you

have no idea what a software product

manager does, you're going to love this episode. It's one of my favorite

disciplines. Basically, product managers are entrepreneurs within larger organizations who are CEOs, essentially, of a particular software product.

I've worked with a lot of product managers or PMs, as they're typically called, and Phil is a masterful one. I've worked with Phil before.

You'll hear a little bit about that story in this episode. He's just an impressive thinker and a really

devout follower of Jesus Christ.

So Phil and I recently sat down, talked about the value of literally

doing what your customer does in order to cultivate empathy

and how this leads Phil and his team at seven shifts to work part time in restaurants to understand their customers.

...