We can talk about personal brand versus corporate brand, which comes from Jason Cohen. So in YPO or EO, they have these executive programs. So I know for YPO, they have this Harvard program you go to. And every year, it's only like they accept 60 to 100 people. It's always sold out every year. But the people you end up meeting because they're so selective with it, they end up being badasses of all these like crazy companies. And when you have YPO international, it's another level. We're talking like they own palaces and like not even one billion. And we're talking tens of billions of dollars. Even EO India for some reason, it's all billionaires. Anybody that's like if you're EO, YPO international, because you're either like super high up or you have no money, basically. In America, it's more kind of distributed, like entrepreneurship is way more accepted, right? But my point of saying this is like these executive programs pay off. But again, it's a very long-term thing. They might know you for a very long time. But because you broke bread together for five to seven days and you did it for two, three years, people will come back to you. no different than you speaking at these things and they come back to you and you have the program from mit right yeah what else what's the other one that you have is that it the yeah i did the it was like a three year program for eo mit program and yeah there are some incredible people from around the world there what i will say i joined that one because three percent of people that go through that and end up becoming billionaires like michael

del went through that so yeah i don't know that again you never but you would never do those things

seven seven days sitting listening you can't do that so how long for each seven day like hour a day

every every no every day you're in class at eight a.m. until 10 p.m.

Nothing. Yeah exactly you would not do that. Yeah but like I love learning these things you know so

like yeah I'll get bored yeah for you get bored like the first hour yeah and you'll be leaving

so okay Jason Cohen tweeted this one um so he said, keep your personal brand separate from your startup brand.

It feels good to mix at first, but it's detrimental in the long run.

It's hard to sell a company that's tied to someone's identity and you can't change positions

like me at WP Engine or leave.

WP Engine sold though. Did they sell?

Yeah, Silver Lake owns WP Engine.

But he's very much tied to it.

Not anymore.

Yeah.

Well, let's take him out of the equation.

A Silver Lake, yeah, private equity firm.

Let's use like a Tony Robbins.

Okay, when Jason Cohen started, WP Engine, yeah, private equity firm. Let's use like a Tony Robbins. Okay, when Jason Cohen started, WP Engine, everyone at least I in my circle knew about it because of him. Yeah. And I think that's helped him grow WP Engine, but now when you look at WP Engine, do you ever think Jason Cohen? I still do. I don't. But that's me.

I don't think most people do.

I think most people look at WP Engine as a standalone engine. You're probably right.

But WP Engine had his own brand.

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