you can't make it up. The usurpers are in charge, the usurpers are in charge.

Yeah, I know it's, it's, it's, it's again, we talk about this. It's a recurring roles,

recurring themes, recurring schemes. And they just, they don't go away. They don't go away.

But because they don't want them to go away. No, I don't think they want to go. I think they love

the whole fucking, they love it the way it is. People seem out here, regular people seem

generally confused by the time they get to our show. They're like, I don't know what to believe.

I don't know what's happening. Do I even believe this guy? Who do I believe? Why should we believe

this guy? If this guy was, like me, when I say this guy, a friend myself, this guy was

a real deal. How can we don't know more about him? How come, you know, his following is

not massive. And so people have to figure, figure the way out that to feel their way out.

Who to trust? Who do you trust? Well, you start trusting somebody by trusting somebody

until you, you can't trust them anymore, right? Yeah. I think it's exhausting. No, I think

people get tired. Yeah. I mean, there's, there's a pretty, pretty cut throat way of,

way of thinking that seems to be adopted by most, most of the population. So it becomes

hard to trust. It comes hard to trust people because they're so fucking cut throat nowadays,

man. So they'll turn on you in a heartbeat. But yeah, I'll fuck one way to say that, whatever.

I forgot. What is it? What did Cooper, what did Bill Cooper get wrong about about Cicero

Exeter? I'm just bouncing around. Well, he didn't pinball. He wasn't wrong. He wasn't wrong.

He didn't, he didn't expose on Cicero. He just said the four, he said the four fathers,

their, their influences were locked. Cicero Aristotle, I think he mentioned a couple others.

I can't remember the names of others. But yeah, that's something I ran across years

ago with the founding fathers influences work. And then he came to conclusions about,

...