Hi there, I'm Lalei Arakoglu with another episode of Women Who Travel.

Thank you. Let's admit it. We all gossip and we all share stories about our travel experiences.

Some are personal. Some are about friends. Some are about people we've never set eyes on. We swap anecdotes about

characters we meet on the road and we tell many, many tales. So to explore, I'm with writer and

journalist Kelsey McKinney, who's just launched a new season of her podcast, Normal Gossip. I'm a big,

big fan of Normal Gossip. I listen to it all the time. Most recently, a memorable

show about a bachelorette party as I was cleaning my apartment, and I sent it to all my friends.

Hi, Kelsey. Welcome, I'm going to say to the studio, but we're looking at each other on screens

right now. Hello, Lollali. Thank you for having me.

I am such a fan for some time because who doesn't love gossip? And stories about other people's

lives that don't affect you. How has your relationship with gossip evolved since it started to be your job?

My relationship with gossip leading up to the creation of normal gossip is that I grew

evangelical, I was taught that gossip was a sin, I stopped being religious at some point in my

young adulthood, and realized that, you know, gossip is so much more than I was taught to believe

it is, right?

It's not slander, which has its own beautiful word.

It's not libel, which has its own word.

It's this kind of like expansive, massive thing that we all do all the time, right?

Like you talking to your mom about what's happening with your cousins is gossip.

You talking to your friends about some girl you hate your cousins is gossip. You talking to your friends

about some girl you hate is gossip, but also you talking to your coworkers about someone at work

who's maybe dangerous and you should stay away from is also gossip. Like the definition is so,

...