If you aren't organizing in tech, there is many opportunities to do so.

And also, if you aren't, you are frankly just as complicit as your company is in the genocide that's taking place in Palestine as, you know, anyone else's. Hello and welcome to Tech Won't Save Us, made a partnership with The Nation magazine. I'm your host,

Paris Marks, and this week my guests are Mohamed Katami and Gabby Shubiner.

Mohamed and Gabi are former Google Software Engineers and are now organizers with no tech for apartheid.

We're now over 10 months into the Israeli military campaign in Gaza that it's hard to deny is a genocide at this point.

We've seen death figures that officially are over 40,000, but a recent report in

the Lancet put them at actually over 180,000 over that period of time. We know that the amount

of bombs that have been dropped are, you know, just hard to imagine. And the photos of dead children

and babies that have been all over our social media feeds for most of that time. It's just

hard to stomach. It's hard to imagine how this can seriously continue. And there are many reasons

that it does, in particular the support of the American government, but also because the

Israeli government and the Israeli military can rely on technological support from major American tech companies.

In particular, companies like Google, Amazon, and Microsoft, and workers at those companies

have been pushing back against those relationships and those contracts since long before October

7th of last year. It's been pretty clear for quite some time that the Israeli military has been

relying on the cloud services of companies like Amazon, Google, and Microsoft, especially after the signing of the Project Nimbus contract in 2021.

But earlier this month, we had a report in 972 magazine by Yuval Abraham that confirmed, at least based on his reporting, that the Israeli military has relied on

some of that cloud infrastructure and AI technologies provided by Google and Amazon in order to

carry out its campaign in Gaza that has killed so many. So this week, I've decided to check in with

some of the organizers at No Tech for apartheid, who used to be Google

workers, and so their expertise is more on the Google side of things, to learn about their

organizing, to learn about the need for tech workers to be pushing back on the relationships that

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