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Theories of Everything with Curt Jaimungal

Nir Lahav: What If Consciousness Follows the Rules of Relativity?

Theories of Everything with Curt Jaimungal

Curt Jaimungal

Physics, Philosophy, Society & Culture, Science

4.6606 Ratings

🗓️ 5 March 2026

⏱️ 186 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

I personally subscribe to The Economist. TOE listeners get 35% off the annual subscription. No other podcast has this! https://economist.com/TOE Physicist Nir Lahav proposes a relativistic theory of consciousness: subjective experience as a genuine physical property manifested only from within a cognitive system's own internal simulation. No prior background in physics or philosophy required. SUPPORT: - Support me on Substack: https://curtjaimungal.substack.com/subscribe - Support me on Crypto: https://commerce.coinbase.com/checkout/de803625-87d3-4300-ab6d-85d4258834a9 - Support me on PayPal: https://www.paypal.com/donate?hosted_button_id=XUBHNMFXUX5S4 JOIN MY SUBSTACK (Personal Writings): https://curtjaimungal.substack.com LISTEN ON SPOTIFY: https://open.spotify.com/show/4gL14b92xAErofYQA7bU4e LINKS MENTIONED: - Nir's Website: https://www.lahavnir.com/about-me - Nir's Papers: https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=LFMD5RkAAAAJ - Nir's Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/Nir.Lahav - Nir's YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@thewonderofscience9863/videos - A Relativistic Theory of Consciousness [Paper]: https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/psychology/articles/10.3389/fpsyg.2021.704270/full - Church-Turing Thesis: https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/church-turing/ - What Is It Like to Be a Bat? [Paper]: https://www.sas.upenn.edu/~cavitch/pdf-library/Nagel_Bat.pdf - On the Electrodynamics of Moving Bodies [TOE]: https://users.physics.ox.ac.uk/~rtaylor/teaching/specrel.pdf - Dialogue Concerning the Two Chief World Systems [Book]: https://amazon.com/dp/037575766X?tag=toe08-20 - Discourse on Metaphysics [Book]: https://amazon.com/dp/1474457789?tag=toe08-20 - The Foundation of the General Theory of Relativity [Paper]: https://sites.pitt.edu/~jdnorton/teaching/cosmology_2025/pdf/Einstein_Extension_Relativity_1916.pdf - Some Functional Effects of Sectioning the Cerebral Commissures in Man [Paper]: https://www.pnas.org/doi/epdf/10.1073/pnas.48.10.1765 - Reasoning or Reciting? [Paper]: https://arxiv.org/abs/2307.02477 - The Conscious Mind [Book]: https://amazon.com/dp/0195117891?tag=toe08-20 - Consciousness Iceberg [TOE]: https://youtu.be/65yjqIDghEk - Michael Levin [TOE]: https://youtu.be/c8iFtaltX-s - Karl Friston [TOE]: https://youtu.be/2v7LBABwZKA - Daniel Dennett [TOE]: https://youtu.be/bH553zzjQlI - Bernardo Kastrup [TOE]: https://youtu.be/lAB21FAXCDE - Joscha Bach [TOE]: https://youtu.be/3MNBxfrmfmI - Matt Segall [TOE]: https://youtu.be/DeTm4fSXpbM - Leo Gura [TOE]: https://youtu.be/YspFR9JAq3w - What Is Energy, Actually? [TOE]: https://youtu.be/hQk9GLZ0Fms - Plato's Cave [TOE]: https://youtu.be/PurNlwnxwfY - Iain McGilchrist [TOE]: https://youtu.be/Q9sBKCd2HD0 - Andres Emilsson: https://youtu.be/BBP8WZpYp0Y - Ruth Kastner [TOE]: https://youtu.be/-BsHh3_vCMQ - Urs Schreiber [TOE]: https://youtu.be/1KUhLHlgG2Q - Ted Jacobson [TOE]: https://youtu.be/3mhctWlXyV8 - Stephen Wolfram [TOE]: https://youtu.be/0YRlQQw0d-4 - Emily Adlam and Jacob Barandes [TOE]: https://youtu.be/rw1ewLJUgOg - David Chalmers [TOE]: https://youtu.be/RH5qjdHhtBk - Donald Hoffman and Philip Goff [TOE]: https://youtu.be/MmaIBxkqcT4 - Donald Hoffman [TOE]: https://youtu.be/CmieNQH7Q4w - Michael Levin and Anil Seth [TOE]: https://youtu.be/_kuwwmFnxGY - Elan Barenholtz [TOE]: https://youtu.be/A36OumnSrWY - Geoffrey Hinton [TOE]: https://youtu.be/b_DUft-BdIE Theories of Everything with Curt Jaimungal features long-form, technically detailed interviews with leading researchers in physics, mathematics, consciousness, and philosophy, exploring topics at the level of active research. For academics, graduate students, and anyone seeking depth beyond popular science. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

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0:00.0

The default assumption for most people in the West is that the brain generates consciousness.

0:05.2

So something brainy, neurological happens, neurons are firing, and then consciousness pops out like steam from a kettle.

0:14.5

Now, you think this is not just wrong, you think it's confused. Before we get technical,

0:20.3

what's the short version of what you think is actually happening?

0:23.8

What actually is happening here is a physical process

0:27.7

and not only computational process

0:30.9

because of relativity that from the outside we can measure neural patterns and from the inside we measure a new physical

0:42.1

entity which we call consciousness. So this is like a one line, you know, of the theory.

0:52.2

Okay, explain how most people, most of your colleagues, who aren't educated in these matters, think of consciousness.

1:00.0

I guess. So if we take people from the street and ask them, what do you think about consciousness?

1:07.6

Most of the people, including me when I was a child, would think that

1:13.4

consciousness is separated than matter. It's something different, you know, very dualistic way

1:19.7

of thinking. I guess maybe because of the influence of religion, you know, we tend to think

1:27.3

of a soul or something like that, right?

1:29.9

But then we saw that actually there is not only great correlation between consciousness and the

1:39.2

brain, but also causation. If I, if we are stimulus, an area in the vision cortex, for example, we can create a conscious

1:54.0

experience of seeing, even though there's nothing there, not just because of the electricity,

2:00.6

of the stimulus that we gave.

2:03.6

And in a different area, if we will stimulate, the person will say that they feel, for example, humor,

2:13.6

or that there is something that is funny all of a sudden.

2:18.3

So we have this causality between the activity of the brain and consciousness.

2:25.3

So you would think that consciousness is just something that emerges from our brain and if we know enough neuroscience

...

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