All right. So this next episode is a collaboration with HubSpot's Marketing Against the Grain podcast. So we got the CMO Kip Bodner and they also have Kieran Flanagan, who's their VP of Marketing on the pod. And it's also Neil and myself. And we talk about the future of marketing. That's where the talk is focused on. We talk about the future of SEO, the future of CRO. What we're excited about. We talk about what's old that is carrying over into the future. It's a great episode. We think

you're going to enjoy it, and we'll see you inside. Big fan of the Marketing School Pod.

I know you both have avid followings because you're deep practitioners of marketing, and you're

kind of deep at the intersection

of both results and kind of emerging trends. And what I'm hoping to do today is take us through

a tour of some of the most important aspects of marketing and talk about them and give people

a new blueprint moving forward. And one of the places that I was

hoping we could start was SEO. SEO, if you go read the SEO subreddit, it's a very depressing place.

There's a lot of people talking about all the traffic they've lost, the websites they're shutting down.

It's very, very doom and gloom. I think you all are probably more positive about the future of SEO and leveraging AI for SEO and those things than most people I talk to. And so I guess I'd love to kick it off and hear from both of you around what's happening with SEO? What's the state of the state?

And what should people who are trying to get traffic from search do in this kind of post-AI era?

Yeah, I'll let Neil go first because he has, he's been saying this quite a bit.

He likes, he has a new definition of SEO that I think is catching on well. So, Neil, why don't you kick it off first?

Yeah, so first off, we look at SEO as not search engine optimization. We look at a search

everywhere optimization. You know, as a Google VP said, I won't read the quote word for word,

but he was talking about how when young people are doing a search, they're now turning to

TikTok and Instagram before Google. People are now asking Chad GPT for questions and hiring companies based on the results that

they're getting on Chad GPT.

Like I was talking to this lady and I was like, how did you find out about us?

She's like, chat GPT told me to hire your marketing from NP Digital.

I was like, all right, sounds great.

Sweet.

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