In an era of geopolitical instability and economic uncertainty, what are the implications for companies and investors?

The emergence of geopolitical swing states, I think cause companies and boards to have to think in a more tactical way new countries will

emerge as kingmakers and so knowing where to place your chips, where to make

your bets, how to align yourself has just become far more complicated.

I'm Allison Nathan and this is exchanges at Goldman Sachs. To help make sense of the opportunities and risks in an increasingly complicated

geopolitical environment, I'm sitting down with Jared Cohen and George Lee, who are the co-heads of Goldman

Sachs's newly created Office of Applied Innovation.

Jared and George work with the firm's clients to explore issues that sit at the center of a changing

global marketplace, shifts in the geopolitical landscape, and rapidly evolving technology.

Jared, George, welcome to the podcast.

Thank you.

Great to be here. Thank you. Jared, let's start with you.

So in addition to this role in the Office of Applied Innovation, you are the president of global

affairs at the firm. It feels like geopolitical issues and tensions are particularly

complicated today. So give us some context. Is that really the case or do we just feel that way because we're living it every day?

So the first thing that I would say is the creation of a role as president of global affairs is an

acknowledgement of just how significant and at least medium likely long-term

all of this geopolitical uncertainty is. We are probably in a moment right now

where the geopolitical uncertainty is at a two decade high.

I think it will get worse for longer.

But the undercurrent of all of this is a larger question about what's happening with globalization.

And I think some of this is the Arab hyper-globilization probably ended well before COVID,

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