Hello, this is Matt from the Explorers podcast.

I want to invite you to join me on the voyages and journeys of the most famous explorers

in the history of the world.

These are the thrilling and captivating stories of Magellan, Shackleton, Lewis, and Clark,

and so many other famous and not-so-famous adventures from throughout

history. Go to Explorespodcast.com or just look us up on your podcast app. That's the Explorers

podcast. Hey all, this is Eric. For today's re-listen, I'm going back to the not-so-distant past,

February 3rd, 2024, and my interview with the

Art of Crime podcast, creator and host Gavin Whitehead. He does a marvelous job of walking us

through the infamous Bermansi horror murder case, very sensational for it for its time.

And it was great fun listening to this once again, and I hope you enjoy it too.

And stick around to the end, by the way, because I do reconnect with Gavin, and he shares

with us a bit about his newest season of the Art of Crime podcast.

All right, let's get to it. Welcome, everyone to another episode of the Most Notorious podcast. I'm Eric Rivenis. So great to have you here with me. And I am very delighted

to have Gavin Whitehead here as well. He is the creator and host of the Art of Crime

podcast. It's a history podcast about the unlikely collisions between true crime and the arts.

And he's here today to tell us all about a really fascinating murder case. Thank you so much for

coming on. Thanks for having me on. So yeah, where did you hear about this case? How did it go from being an

idea to a fully researched story? It's so interesting, especially its connection to Madame

Tussaud. Sure. Yeah. So in a past life, I was a theater historian, and I hold a doctorate essentially in theater

history. And I wrote my doctoral dissertation on horror theater in London from 1794 to 1931.

And I wrote four chapters, as is pretty standard for dissertation. I dealt with a lot of ghost plays.

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