When word came at Mikhail Gorbachev, the last president of the Soviet Union, had died at the age of 91,

there was a mix of sadness in the West and sorrow, silence and indifference in parts of Russia.

This is no surprise. Gorbachev's relatively short time in power

was marked by extraordinary accomplishments, including the withdrawal of Soviet forces from Afghanistan

and the end of the Cold War.

In Moscow, however, President Putin has described this period in slightly different terms,

stating that the end of the Soviet Union was the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the century.

I'm your host James Rogers, this is the warfare podcast,

and with Gorbachev's contested legacy in mind,

I thought we'd focus in on one of his most controversial achievements, his Intermediate Range Nuclear Force INF treaty,

which eliminated for the first time in history an entire class of nuclear weapons.

To take us through this history, we have my old friend Dr. Susan Colborn on the podcast.

Now Susie is the author of a new book, Euromissiles, the nuclear weapons that nearly destroyed

NATO, making her the ideal person to help us understand Gorbachev's controversial time in power

and his enduring legacy. Hi Susie, welcome to the Warfare Podcast. How you doing? I'm good, how are you today? I'm good. I'm in New York City, so apologies for all the sirens that go past.

I mean, I'm in a hotel room.

It's meant to be insulated, but it just sounds like the police are constantly outside

my window, which I don't think is a reflection on me, I hope.

We hope.

We'll keep our fingers crossed where are you in the world I am in

Durham North Carolina Durham North Carolina that has to be number one on my next place to

visit in America not just because it's

...