This is an I-Heart podcast.

This is Solvable. I'm Jacob Weissberg.

We're back interviewing leaders and change makers about how to solve the world's biggest problems. And sometimes it starts with looking back at our own history.

When, if ever, were we like other countries?

Back in 1970, we incarcerated at the same rate

as other countries in this world.

The killing of George Floyd has brought calls

for transforming policing into the national spotlight.

With so many people taking to the streets

demanding action now, we have to maintain our confidence

that even the hardest problems related to racial justice can be solved.

How do you break this problem down into solvable pieces?

Decide to stop prosecuting and charging low-level crimes.

Don't criminalize those behaviors.

Justice isn't blind. We have to be far more critical

and thoughtful and have that lens on. Today, we're going to talk about how to solve mass

incarceration. This is such a solvable problem. In Shah Rakhman used to work as a public defender in the Bronx. That job illuminated, for her,

the variety of state, national level problems with the criminal justice system. The U.S. has 5%

of the world's population, but currently holds 25% of the world's incarcerated people.

Rockman is the director of strategy and new initiatives at the Vera Institute,

an organization devoted to improving the criminal justice system in the United States.

Rockman thinks those extremely disproportionate numbers represent a problem we can solve.

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