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Hello and welcome to Marshall Matters with me, Winston Marshall at The Spectator.

Today I have the pleasure of been joined by Michael

Schellenberger, who, as well as writing the books San Francisco, Apocalypse Never, as a history,

as an environmentalist, also ran as a Californian gubernatorial candidate, and actually has the

dubious honour of being my first return guest to Marshall Matters.

But since we last spoke, which I think was in October, November last year,

you've had an incredible run, and your sort of life and career has taken another kind of swing.

And as well as building up public, your newsletter, you're also one of the Twitter files journalists,

along with Matt Taibi, Barry Weiss, Lee Fang, Dave Zweig, others, David, I've had the pleasure

of speaking to him as well. And only last, I think, week or two weeks ago, you exposed what has

been called for the last three years a conspiracy theory about patients zero being at the

Wuhan Institute virology. So there's lots to discuss. But Michael, thank you so much for coming

to speak with me today. Winston's pleasure. Thanks for having me back on. So actually, the reason

you're in London is you're doing this event with your co-Twiter files, journalist Matt Tybee, as well as Rusty Rockets himself,

Russell Brand, at Central Hall Westminster, exposing the censorship industrial complex.

For people who have no idea what the censorship industrial complex is, How would you describe it? Well, to answer that

...