Hey, this is the moment. I'm Brian Koppelman. Thanks for listening. I'm sitting here. My

guest today is the brilliant Mark injuries and if you're using the internet you pretty much

have him to thank.

Mark invented Mosaic and Netscape

and is also among the leading VCs in the world

and his company, Andrews and Horowitz.

And someone I've been lucky enough to become quite friendly with over the last few years and it's been very helpful behind the scenes with billions.

So Mark Andrews and thanks for being here.

It's an honor.

Here being your office by the way, but thanks for being in your office on a Saturday to talk to me.

So I was just with a bunch of VCs

over the last few days, and the highest thinking compliment

that I saw people give was that somebody was an abstract thinker and they understood systems.

And that's something that said about you in the New Yorker article that was written about you.

Can you talk a little bit about what it means to be a systems thinker?

Yeah, so maybe let's try to make it and start with concrete,

we'll start with concrete and then maybe make that concept

that be great abstract.

So the concrete thing, so just think about it through the lens of a new tech

product, which is kind of the center of what we do which is this like if you're not a

a system thinker basically you say is I'm going to build a really great product right and then

it's I'm going to have a really great product and it's going to be great because it's a really

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