You're listening to a podcast from Blogging Heads TV.

Hi, Justin.

Hello, Bob.

How you doing?

Well, fine.

Excellent.

Let me introduce this.

I'm Robert Wright, publisher of the Non-Zero Newsletter.

This is a Non-Zero podcast.

You are Justin Logangan let me read

your title for you in case you've forgotten it you're director of defense and foreign policy

studies at the cato institute which that covers the waterfront so far as certainly so far as this

conversation is concerned i want to talk about a few things today with you. One is America's policy toward

China, especially with respect to Taiwan, something that I think you're something of an expert on.

I mean, it's a pretty high-level item in your bio, your interest in Chinese strategy. I want to talk

a little about something else that is mentioned in your kind of boilerplate

Cato bio, which is a grand strategy.

But I want to start out talking about something a little different, which is the so-called

restrainer coalition.

As we will soon discover, that's a name you don't like.

But it's a kind of a left-right coalition that shares a skepticism about American foreign policy broadly, certainly including its militaristic dimension.

And there's been talk, in fact, there's been talk on a podcast I did last week with Derek

...