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Hey everybody, John Howman here and welcome to part 2 of the very special two-part Heyman, Howman, Hellen Highwater.

With the airtime senior reporter and the dominant definitive reporter of the Trump beat in the Trump era, also the author of a book that's destined to be the dominant definitive book about Donald Trump in the Trump era, Confidence Man, the making of Donald Trump and the breaking of America.

Part 1, we talked about some news that Maggie broke while she was promoting the book is still like in her spare time while reporting the book and running from cable studio to cable studio TV thing to TV thing to radio thing to radio thing, podcast thing to podcast thing she's out there also just with the whatever portion of her brain that's not focused on telling people about this incredible book she's written.

And so it's like reporting like a maniac and breaking stories that matter to the future of the nation about the possibility of Donald Trump actually has more class by documents still hidden away somewhere at Bedminster who knows the trunk of his car.

I don't think he drives. Anyway, that's we had all that in the first section. We also talked about Maggie's whole coverage of Trump before he got into politics, which is like in some ways some of the most important things in this book because they're they feel genuinely fresh.

It's like how New York, the outer burrows of the 70s and 80s and Manhattan of the 80s and 90s kind of gave birth to Donald Trump. That is what really a lot of ways what part one of this podcast was about and about Maggie's assessment on the basis of a lot of reporting kind of coming to some some very astute and acute psychological and character logical insights about who Trump really is related to race and women and transactionality.

And his very dark kind of view of the human soul and why that's really kind of depressing, but also has served him pretty well. We also talked about some of the things that have upset people about Maggie in the world, including the notion that somehow she's like she saved stuff for the book and didn't put it out when she first learned about it.

And if only she put it out things would be different. Maggie talks about all that stuff pretty forthrightly in the first part of the podcast.

So so part one, if you haven't listened to it yet, you got to hit pause right now and go back and check it out. It's not going to make as much sense to listen to part two until you listen to part one. So please do that.

And then you come back here and then you listen to part two in what you'll hear about all the stuff that happens once Trump gets into politics talk about 2016. His presidency, the 2020 campaign stuff that happened then the insurrection, the post presidential dilemmas that Trump faces on the legal front.

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