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That's VANTA.com slash cyber for $1,000 off Banta. Hello, Hello everyone and welcome to the CyberWire's Research Saturday.

I'm Dave Bitner and this is our weekly conversation with researchers and analysts tracking down the threats and vulnerabilities,

solving some of the hard problems and protecting ourselves in a rapidly evolving cyberspace.

Thanks for joining us. What the team have been doing is working on a generative AI platform.

What the team have been doing is working on a generative AI platform where we can talk to and from criminals and actually work out

what is happening in that scam by kind of playing the victim, playing along with the conversation and seeing what happens next.

That's Robert Duncan, VP of product strategy at Netcraft.

The research we're discussing today is titled Mule as a service infrastructure exposed. And by extracting that kind of detailed insight over the course of conversation, You can then start to link conversations together and then identify groups.

And then that's what's led to this discovery of these centralized meal account services.

So I think to kind of take a different twist on that and think about what that looks like.

When you're thinking about, you know, you're a cyber criminal you want to

eventually extract some money from from the victim. The types of cyber crime we're

talking about here are not nation state actors they're typically

financially motivated and their overall goal is to extract money.

...