Kate Bowler on how to accompany those who are suffering

The Spiritual Life with Fr. James Martin, S.J.

America Media

Spirituality, Religion & Spirituality, Christianity

4.9 • 1.2K Ratings

🗓️ 24 March 2026

⏱️ 65 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

American culture often tries to emphasize “learning lessons” in the middle of suffering. For example, “Everything happens for a reason.” But Kate Bowler doesn’t think those “lessons” are coming from God; rather, God draws close to the brokenhearted and accompanies them. On this episode of “The Spiritual Life” podcast host James Martin, S.J. is joined by scholar of American religion history, Kate Bowler, who is also the creator of the popular podcast “Everything Happens” and the author of bestselling books including Everything Happens for a Reason (and Other Lies I’ve Loved) and No Cure for Being Human. Her latest book is Joyful, Anyway! Timecodes: 0:00 God’s grace is not like math 1:05 Who is Kate Bowler? 5:22 How getting diagnosed with stage 4 cancer changed Kate’s faith 11:55 What not to say to someone who is suffering 19:38 How to accompany those who suffer 26:37 The problem with happiness and “good vibes only” 31:32 The paradox and practice of joy 44:10 Kate’s spiritual practices of honesty and service 47:35 Why its so hard to suffer in America 50:00 Audience Question: How do we believe in a just and loving God in the midst of an unjust and unloving world? 56:30 Kate’s blessing Read Fr. Jim's article on suffering Do you have a spiritual question for Fr. Jim? You can write to us at: thespirituallife@americamedia.org Become a subscriber today at Americamagazine.org/subscribe Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0	Why does the term health care leave people feeling sick to their stomach? Maybe it's because instead
0:04.5	of being tied to health, the word seems to have a deeper connection to industries. At Catholic
0:09.5	Health Care, we're returning the word health care back to its former glory, because when
0:13.9	health care really cares, communities thrive, prevention is prioritized, and everyone has access to
0:19.9	care. Say it with has access to care.
0:22.4	Say it with me, health care.
0:24.1	Sounds better already.
0:27.9	Catholic Health Care, We Care, You Flourish.
0:30.2	Sponsored by the Catholic Health Association.
0:35.6	How is it possible that we can have a temporary,
0:38.7	transcendent feeling of wholeness in the middle of an absolute mess. Like most of the great gifts of God have no relationship to our effort, no relationship
0:44.4	to math, and have only to do with the fact that we are somehow chosen in all this universe
0:50.4	to be God's precious creatures.
0:57.0	Welcome to the spiritual life. I'm Father Jim Martin.
1:00.0	On this podcast, we reflect on how people experience God in their prayer and in their daily
1:05.0	lives. And I'm joined by my long-suffering producer, Maggie Van Dorn.
1:10.0	Maggie, it's good to be with you and I'm using that word for a reason.
1:14.3	It's great to be with you, Jim.
1:16.3	This show is pure delight and joy, but we all do suffer.
1:21.7	And I think that headlines the subject of this episode very well.
1:27.9	Yeah, this time we're speaking with the amazing Kate Bowler.
1:31.7	We can talk about why we wanted her on the show, but can you tell us a little bit more about
	...

Please login to see the full transcript.

Previous episode | Next episode

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from America Media, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of America Media and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.