It's Notes from America. I'm Kai Wright and you are listening to our election special series on the call each

Thursday until election day I am wringing up somebody who's written or said

something about this election that's peaked my interest and picking their brain.

This week, on the heels of the presidential debate,

I am once again on the call with my friend

Ellie Mistahl, Justice Correspondent for the Nation magazine.

Hello, Ellie.

Hello, Kai, how are you?

Well, I am digesting what happened on the debate stage

in Pennsylvania with the rest of us.

Maybe, let's start here.

Your pre-debate column,

which is why I called you up, warned that there was no real winning an argument

with the bad faith debaters of the Maga world that this is a lesson you've learned over the

years of trying to win such arguments.

And I actually want to get into your own experience and approach in, you know, here in a minute,

the why you argue the way you do.

I think, you know, we've talked a little bit about that in the past.

But let's start with the debate itself.

Your advice to Harris was to bait Trump at every turn.

And it seems like she did exactly that yeah oh yeah let's let's remember I

ended that article with saying if we come out of the debate with the same candidate that we

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