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Season C's apply book today at hmhair.uk Hello and welcome to Trigonometry. I'm

Frances Foster. I'm Constantin Kissen and this is a show for you if you want

honest conversations with fascinating people. We're delighted to say that our

guest today is a very special man. It is, of course, Jordan B. Peterson, author

psychologist and in inspiration to a lot of people, he's just written a book

called Beyond Order, 12 more rules for life. Here it is. Thank you for the

advanced copy Jordan and thank you for coming on the show. Thank you guys for

the invitation. I'm very much looking forward to it. It's very kind of you to

accept. Let's get straight into the book first of all. One of the themes that

you've explored most of all in your last two books is of course order and

chaos and that tension that exists I think within societies but also within

individuals between the safety, your boredom of order and the danger and

simultaneously excitement of chaos. What is a healthy balance and how does one

get there at an individual level but also the level of society? What does that

look like? Well, I think you're actually calibrated to detect that healthy

balance with the deepest of emotional and cognitive instincts and I mean

instinct. I think it's biologically based. So you have two problems at least

two problems as a living organism in an environment that's too complex. You

have to maintain security but you also have to stay updated as things around

...