Hey everyone, you're listening to Code Switch from NPR.

I'm B.A. Parker.

And I'm Gene Dempie.

So, Gene, we got back to the studio, and we're immediately way behind on news.

Right? You're playing catch-up on the U.S. seizing a foreign leader.

More violence from ICE. Like, in a a foreign leader, more violence from ice.

Like, in a lot of ways, it feels like we are just playing all the hits.

Yeah.

Jeez.

I think that part is what I want to make sense of.

Like, that this has all been snowballing and it's nothing new.

So I went to an historian and journalist who'd been reflecting on the recent past.

I'm really interested in, you know, these questions of how we protect and sustain democracy.

I spoke with Jelani Cobb about his recent collection of essays called

Three or More is a Riot, Notes on How We Got Here, 2012 to 2025.

These are pieces that were written in real time over the course of that time span.

And Jelani's writing is a reflection on the past 13 years and how it leads us to now,

one year into President Trump's second term.

It's wild because that period of 13 years is basically how long Code Switch as a team has been around.

I mean, although the podcast ain't come out until a couple years into it.

But I remember bumping into Jalani when Shireen and I were reporting for Ferguson, Missouri, during the unrest there.

So I know I was giving a talk recently to a bunch of college students, and they clearly did not know what I was talking about when I referenced Ferguson, which, wow.

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