I have a quick but important ask. As you're probably aware, Green Dreamer is an independent

podcast and we don't take on corporate advertisers to fund our work because we don't want those

considerations to influence our curiosities or our abilities to question whatever it is that we want to question.

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We need your direct support in order to continue this podcast.

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So for instance, right now we're seeing major issues with illegal succulent harvesting in say Southern Africa and also in Eastern Africa. And largely this has to do with sort of

changing popularities and aesthetic tastes and what kinds of plants are really popular within

the ornamental trade. But a lot of those species right now we're seeing

are being really, really heavily hit by illegal harvesting.

And some of those species have actually already been harvested

to extinction in the wild, unfortunately.

You're listening to Green Dreamer, and I'm your host, Kamaya Shane.

Today we are speaking with Dr. Jared Margulis, an assistant professor in the Department of Geography

at the University of Alabama, whose work engages across more than human geographies,

political ecology, and the geo-humanities.

Jared's new book, The Cactus Hunters, Desire and Extinction in the Illicit Succulent Trade

Explores the Explosive Illegal Trade in Succulents and the Passion That Drives It.

He begins here by offering a backdrop of what the illegal trade in succulence looks like.

...