Walk me through what it was like for you when you were trying to figure out what you were going to do next.

Yeah, it was, so the first night, the day that I got laid off from NBC,

the best piece of advice I got was from Brian Hamilton who's a friend of mine.

He just covered college basketball for the athletic.

Prior to that, covered Notre Dame for the Tribune,

but in between those two stops he was at Sports Illustrated and he got laid off from there.

And he told me that nothing is going to change, nothing you do tonight is going to change so just get drunk man

we had some friends you know this is still in the pandemic we had some friends send over a bottle of

tequila and you know had a had a couple drinks. It just you know got got the boys to bed and just you know was like all right well I'm not changing anything today uh but it was it was so

weird lorants because it was like attending your own funeral where like you know

the the Twitter messages and the people calling and texting you it was it was a lot but that day there are two people who called me with just like the

calls meant a lot to me and one of them was you and you were basically like

whenever you're ready I got something for you but I don't need to be ready right now and the other one was Jeff Dickerson who was like I got I got five guys you need to talk to they're gonna be great they're gonna help you out

so the next day it kind of started the the process of like all right let me let me start thinking about do I want to stay in the business do I want to try to do something else and then the day after that day after that

Brandon Faber from the Bears reached out to me. Hey uh jobs open with

the colts as a team writer is that something you'd be interested in? I was like sure what's the worst

that could happen? I'll do the interview and say no thanks or they'll say no thanks or you know

all right yeah because I was I remembered something that John Moon

Mullen told me which was like being a team writer is a really good job because you're

not necessarily subject to the whims of a journalism industry that half the time doesn't know what it's doing and just lays people off because it doesn't know what it's doing.

So did the interview, came out of it like bouncing, being like, oh my gosh, like I would go work for these people in a heartbeat.

You know, I had some back and forth.

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