Stoveleg Media, igniting conversation. Hey, true crime cast fans, excited to share with you today an interview with Robin

Dreak, a former Marine Corps officer and retired FBI special agent, where he serves as

the chief of the FBI's counterintelligence behavioral analysis

program. We talk recruiting spies, ways to detect deception, and Robin's latest book. For today's

interview, we're going to join in the middle of the conversation. We got to talking, didn't want to

stop and reset.

So we just hit record before we did a formal introduction.

So here you go, joining in the middle of a conversation.

Enjoy.

You know, I was about more than just body language.

My whole goal and everything I was doing was how are I going to form a

lasting relationship beyond transactional because transactional relationships like Chris Voss,

retired FBI guy, hostage negotiator, one of the best in the world hands down. But what these

crisis negotiators focus on is a transactional dialogue and relationship. And it's very effective, very good. I need to keep going

because if you're going to work with confidential human sources, spies, recruitments, and all that,

it's much more than a transactional relationship. It's a real deep-seated, rooted relationship forged on trust.

And so when I'm doing my assessments, yeah, body language plays a

large part of it because I'm going to get a lot of leakage on whether I'm making a connection

or not. And most importantly, are they comfortable and feel safe? Because that's the preeminent thing

that inspires people to move forward is fear and safety. Do they feel safe with me? And what happens is in my mind,

if you're focused only on body language and interpreting what the body language is doing,

you're missing everything else because you're giving yourself a body language confirmation bias.

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