Now amidst the horror of the last few months we've seen shifting actually I would say in

Western public opinion people have seen too much to unsee heard too much to unread, and that has had a profound impact to Western public opinion.

But the Israeli state is not stupid, and it is aware that it depends on Western's age, not least the United States for arms diplomatic

support, aid, political support.

And it has deployed at state level a an extensive attempt to I suppose contain the political consequences of people being horrified at mass slaughter.

Now with that in mind I'm really delighted to be speaking to the brilliant journalist Lee-Fank who is a great

investigative journalist, brilliant political journalist who writes on a whole range of different subjects and has a substack, please do check out the substack, do you click on it and support it and you can see the kind of really kind of in depth journalistic work that he's been

in on this and so many other topics. So Lee how you doing? I'm doing great.

Oh and it's really good to join you. Thanks for having me. I just want to start with, so you did this actually a few months ago and it was actually published

partly in the gallery newspaper as well, the work that you did.

And this was concerning, I mean this is the amateur chickly, who's the liquid

minister who has been leading a targeted push to counter critics of Israel.

Can you just explain, what did you find, basically, what was this about?

Well, we took a look at, I did this with a close friend of mine, co-author Jack Paulson.

We took a look at this government entity,

government agency, the Ministry of Diasper Affairs,

led by Amichai Chickley.

And it's basically the reboot of a very controversial

public relations effort.

Now, the Israeli government has its own separate budget for public relations for you know they

they fly a lot of people in to the country to you know lobby them and show them

you know the Israel side of the story.

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