A specter is haunting Europe and the United States, the specter of Judith Butler.

Judith Butler is one of the great public intellectuals of our age. You'll see you on going with that.

One of the great public intellectuals of our age who has inspired, particularly, I guess, younger generations.

I don't know if we can still throw millennials in there. Millennials go up to about 43 now.

I'm a geriatric millennial. The reason to talk about the perspective of Judith Butler is we're talking,

you know, we obviously talk a lot on this channel about the rise of the far right of fascism.

And Judith Butler has become one of the great bettunas of the far right movements in Europe and the United States, which I would say is something to be pretty proud of.

Last time I interviewed you was four years ago, and a fair bit has happened since then.

I want to say a fair bit, I think the general

dissent into hell has been pretty steep and has particularly, you know, in the last two years

become acute, I would say. We'll talk later on, we'll talk about Palestine.

We'll talk about Trumpism in general.

You've written Who's Afraid of Gender?

Really brilliant.

It's now on paperback.

Everyone do go and get yourself a copy.

We'll talk about that.

But the reason, you know, you've been at the forefront of talking about questions of gender for so long.

And I think when we talk about, say, Trumpism 2.0 and Trumpism 1.0, if that's possible,

what has definitely shifted is transphobia, the anti-trans backlash, has become particularly fervent.

I was in the US for the elections and sitting, I went from state to state in the Rust Belt, and you would hear these, from a British perspective, quite jarring political

ads because we don't have them here, where they would just often go in hard on transphobia.

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