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Gaslit Nation

Israel and Palestine: A Difficult Discussion

Gaslit Nation

Gaslit Nation

Politics, Society & Culture, News

4.74.1K Ratings

🗓️ 11 October 2023

⏱️ 55 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

"What do you mean 'Hamas paratroopers'? Hamas doesn't have paratroopers." That was the reaction of someone first learning the news of this weekend's terrorist attack across Israel, the worst mass-murder of Jews since the Holocaust. In this important discussion, Andrea is joined by Terrell Starr, host of the Black Diplomats podcast, who recently visited the West Bank and produced a series on Iran–a terrorist regime that reportedly helped in the planning of Hamas's widespread attack.
 
In this conversation, we share our grief and anger for civilians in Israel and Gaza. We were already living in a time of collective grief before Hamas's atrocities this weekend and their ISIS execution terror videos. And now things have escalated with serious ramifications for the region, the world, and yes, the US election. The discussion includes what Benjamin Netanyahu's extremists in government have in common with Trump's extremists; how the war in Israel will galvanize Trump's base that supports Israel as a means to fulfill a prophecy ushering in the apocalypse; and how lessons in aiding Ukraine can help inform how to help Israel and Palestine meaningfully work towards a two-state solution.
 
The show notes for this week's episode are a collection of trusted sources and voices helping us make sense of this tragic time and its complex history. Our bonus episode will be Andrea and Terrell sharing how to have difficult conversations about world events while trying to remain friends, how to protect mental health during a time of mass trauma and grief, and how to sustain conversations online in a way that protects yourself and your community. It also includes hard lessons learned from mistakes in US foreign policy, in relation to Russia, over the last ten years.
Next week's bonus episode will be a deep-dive Q&A so keep your questions coming. To get access to that, support the show at the Truth-teller level or higher on Patreon by subscribing at Patreon.com/Gaslit! Thank you to everyone who supports the show – we could not make Gaslit Nation without you!
 
Show Notes:
How to Help Victims of the Israel-Gaza War https://time.com/6322238/how-to-help-israel-gaza-war-victims/
 
Anne Applebaum: "this government, which is the worst government in the history of the state of Israel, led by a corrupt, dysfunctional, and egoistic man who sees only himself—Benjamin Netanyahu—failed us." An extraordinary survivors' story: https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2023/10/amir-tibon-how-his-family-survived-hamas-massacre/675596/
 
"The current government of Israel is not a partner for any constructive plan in the region. It is overwhelmed by ultra-nationalistic and messianic ideas, lack of experience, and inferior intellectual capacity." https://time.com/6322046/israel-after-hamas-attack/
 
Louis Fishman, Associate Prof Brooklyn College; Author of Jews and Palestinians in late Ottoman era: Turkish: "For months experts in the Israeli media warned that this gov was ignoring the growing security threat as a result of the pushback to Netanyahu's judicial coup; they said Israel was losing its military superiority as more people refused serving in the reserves. Now we are here." https://twitter.com/Istanbultelaviv/status/1711521792945516716
 
Mattia Nelles, German Ukraine analyst: Yair Golan, the former Israeli left Wing MP, is a true hero 👇 https://twitter.com/gadishamia/status/1711240299987562977
 
Amir Tibon @amirtibon Diplomatic Correspondent for Haaretz Newspaper, Israel to Josh Hawley: "What a cynical move. Shame on you Senator. Iran is sending drones to Ukraine and guns to Gaza, to murder Ukrainians and murder Israelis. God help us if USA cant support both countries against this brutal anti-democratic axis. Glad Biden is in charge." https://twitter.com/amirtibon/status/1711597411007627510
 
Israel massed troops in the West Bank. Then Hamas attacked from Gaza. https://wapo.st/3rC42FT
 
Lisa Goldman: "The Israeli media now confirming that the gov't did receive clear warnings from Egyptian intelligence about the imminent attack that occurred on October 7. The PM's office initially issued a flat denial after the first report, but then did an about face and admitted it." (Source: Channel 13 Hebrew) https://twitter.com/lisang/status/1711824708746838214
 
Kurt Andersen: "Until now I hadn't really known of this piece of the recent history, the Netanyahu governments' de facto alliance with Hamas, intended to prevent a real Palestinian state and 2-state solution. This is the distinguished @haaretzcom journalist Gidi Weitz." https://twitter.com/KBAndersen/status/1711527406383558834 // https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-09/ty-article/.premium/another-concept-implodes-israel-cant-be-managed-by-a-criminal-defendant/0000018b-1382-d2fc-a59f-d39b5dbf0000
 
Israel's new far-right: Who is Itamar Ben Gvir?
 
Palestinians scramble for safety as Israel pounds sealed-off Gaza Strip to punish Hamas https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-gaza-hamas-airstrikes-hostages-bf6c42f84526c4d9416978c8effd932a
 
The bombs raining down on Gaza from Israel are beyond scary, beyond crazy https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2023/10/10/the-bombs-raining-down-on-gaza-are-beyond-scary-beyond-crazy
 
What to know about the deteriorating humanitarian situation in Gaza https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/10/what-is-the-humanitarian-situation-in-gaza
 
Iran Helped Plot Attack on Israel Over Several Weeks https://www.wsj.com/world/middle-east/iran-israel-hamas-strike-planning-bbe07b25
 
Trial of the Century: Revisiting the Dreyfus affair. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2009/09/28/trial-of-the-century
 
The assassination of Yitzhak Rabin: 'He never knew it was one of his people who shot him in the back' https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/oct/31/assassination-yitzhak-rabin-never-knew-his-people-shot-him-in-back
 
Netanyahu's Supreme Court overhaul effort seen by protesters as threat to Israel's democracy https://www.cbsnews.com/news/benjamin-netanyahu-israel-supreme-court-60-minutes-transcript/
 
 
Jerusalem embassy: Why Trump's move was not about peace https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-44120428
 
Max Seddon of FT: Putin finally makes his first comments on the Israel-Palestine war. He says it's "a clear example of the failure of US policy in the Middle East" for not "taking the core interests of the Palestinian people into account" and working to create an independent Palestinian state. https://twitter.com/maxseddon/status/1711721613610324242
 
Olga Lautman: What a ridiculous NYT article. Zero mention that for decades Russia supports Hamas, has extremely close relations w Hezbollah, works alongside Hezbollah to murder countless Syrians, and supplied weapons for many decades. Why is NYT waiting for condolences from the Kremlin?https://twitter.com/OlgaNYC1211/status/1711708594872226243
 
Lisa Rubin: In my head, I keep seeing one video over and over: A woman, who appears to be teenaged, being dragged by her hair into a truck and wearing sweatpants that are entirely soiled in the crotch. 1/ https://twitter.com/lawofruby/status/1711515444979306825
 
Noga Tarnopolsky: No, Vladimir Putin's silence on the attack by Hamas shows that Netanyahu made a catastrophic strategic error by thinking he was Putin's friend. As @YadlinAmos said all along. https://twitter.com/NTarnopolsky/status/1711704721050804319
 
Trump's Overrated Peace Plan Helped Enable the Horrors in Israel and Gaza https://www.thedailybeast.com/trumps-overrated-peace-plan-helped-enable-horrors-in-israel-gaza
 
Vice News: An Iranian teenage girl has been hospitalised after a reported attack in the Tehran Metro by the country's so-called "morality police." Hengaw Organisation for Human Rights said Armita Geravand, 16, lost consciousness after being assaulted at a metro station on Sunday. https://twitter.com/VICENews/status/1709605211310903745
 
Elon Musk's X Cut Disinformation-Fighting Tool Ahead of Israel-Hamas Conflict https://www.theinformation.com/articles/elon-musks-x-cut-disinformation-fighting-tool-ahead-of-israel-hamas-conflict
 
US increases pressure on Ukraine to do more to counter corruption https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/03/politics/us-ukraine-pressure-counter-corruption/index.html
 
BOOK RECOMMENDATION: House of Bush, House of Saud The Secret Relationship Between the World's Two Most Powerful Dynasties By Craig Unger 

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

It's hard to even explain exactly just the mass casualties that happened right here.

0:06.0

In fact, the Israeli military says they still don't have a clear number, but I'm talking to some of the soldiers and they say what they've witnessed as they've been walking through these different houses, these different communities, babies, their heads caught off. That's what they said. Gun down, families completely

0:24.3

gun down in their beds. You can see some of these soldiers right now comforting each other.

0:30.9

Many of them reserves who jumped into action, leaving their own families behind as well,

0:36.5

not knowing the sheer horror that they were about to come to.

0:40.3

They say they've never experienced anything like this.

0:43.3

This is nothing that anyone could have even imagined when you're walking through here.

0:48.3

Baby cribs thrown to the side.

0:51.3

Doors thrown wide open.

0:55.2

Still, some Israeli bodies still here because the fighting in this community just ended just recently.

1:02.3

So many of these troops are still going house to house door to door.

1:06.5

It's taken them sometimes 30 minutes, 40 minutes because many of these houses are also still have grenades in them, booby traps. In fact, as we're trying to get closer to some of these scenes,

1:14.6

we're being told, no, no, no, get back from some of these Israeli military because there

1:19.6

are still grenades in the area. I want us to keep walking through, continue to kind of see

1:24.6

the destruction that's happening on the ground here. Even something as simple as

1:30.9

as a soccer net just left to the side here as people were with their families playing. I see in the

1:37.4

distance more bodies being covered all the while as they're covering these Israeli bodies trying to evacuate everyone else from the

1:46.4

territory taking all the casualties out of here. It's also littered with the bodies of terrorists.

1:52.3

So we're hearing from one of the lead commanders here. It was anywhere from maybe 70 armed terrorists

1:57.4

who made their way here from the Gaza border fence, which is less than a quarter of a mile away.

2:03.0

And as I said, the atrocities that they committed violence with guns, with grenades, with knives,

2:09.5

targeting these innocent civilians inside their homes.

...

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