Is it true that out-of-work benefits have almost doubled?

More or Less

BBC

Business, Mathematics, Science, News Commentary, News

4.6 • 3.5K Ratings

🗓️ 17 September 2025

⏱️ 30 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Tim Harford investigates some of the numbers in the news. This week:

Nigel Farage says 6.5 million people are on out-of-work benefits – with some benefits up 80% since 2018. Are those numbers right?

Do French pensioners really earn more than their working-age compatriots?

How is it possible for one kilogram of fish food to produce one kilogram of salmon?

And do we really have five senses?

If you’ve seen a number you think we should take a look at, email the team: [email protected]

Presenter: Tim Harford Reporter: Lizzy McNeill Producer: Nicholas Barrett Series producer: Tom Colls Production co-ordinator: Maria Ogundele Sound mix: Neil Churchill Editor: Richard Vadon

Transcript

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0:00.0	BBC Sounds, music, radio, podcasts.
0:05.6	Your time starts now.
0:07.2	You're about to listen to a BBC podcast.
0:09.4	Absolutely right.
0:11.5	So, you might like to know that the BBC makes loads of other podcasts.
0:15.6	Really?
0:16.4	Wow.
0:17.2	Many of them are very funny.
0:19.1	Which I think means...
0:20.3	A hatful of ha-hars. And energy. Even if we do say so ourselves. I agree 100% of that. Find them all on BBC Sounds. Just tell us a joke. Come on, tell us a joke. Come on, tell us a joke. Just search comedy on BBC Sounds. I'm really looking forward to getting stuck in. Hello and welcome to more or less.
0:38.3	We're the programme that takes the er out of numbers.
0:41.6	Is that any better?
0:43.2	Doesn't that just leave numbs?
0:45.9	Who writes these scripts?
0:47.5	Well, I read them and I'm Tim Harford.
0:49.7	And this week, we explore the idea that there's a class of people who really won the lottery
0:54.9	of life, and they are pensioners in France. We look at the possibility that salmon are a sort
1:01.2	of perpetual motion machine, except for food. And if there's one number you can really be sure
1:07.7	of, it is that there are five senses. Hmm, hold that thought. But first,
1:14.4	unemployment and the benefit system are hot political potatoes at the moment, with a general sense
1:20.1	that things are bad and getting worse. There are lots of numbers flying around, and one that
1:25.3	keeps reappearing is about the number of people who are claiming
	...

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