Before we go any further, I realise that many of you must have been listening to this podcast thinking,

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journalism. Hello, I'm Matt Kelly. And I'm Matt Dan Cona. And this is the two mats for the

weekending Friday the 26th of April, the podcast that celebrates St George's Day in the traditional

manner. Didn't we, Matt? Did we? Not really, but it's's a nice is it traditional to interview to authors

I think it is and and and what authors so we had um our friend Tom Baldwin who we had

the other day to talk about his Stama biography he's written another book um Tom is a

you know very distinguished journalist and he was director of comms for the Labour Party and

written this book on Kyrs-Darmer and his friend and colleague Mark Steers is co-authored this book

on England and Mark is he's now the director of the UCL Policy Lab he was a professor

at Oxford before and he was also chief

speech rights to the Labour Party. So they're a high powered pair and they've written this book

about England and what it means and they've been travelling around and we had a absolutely fascinating

chat. We did. It's called England's seven myths that changed a country and how to set them straight.

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