meta_pixel
Tapesearch Logo
Log in
Discovery

Inside Universe 25

Discovery

BBC

Science

4.31.2K Ratings

🗓️ 20 April 2026

⏱️ 27 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

“I shall largely speak of mice,” the paper begins “but my thoughts are on man.”

So begins a truly extraordinary scientific paper, and an equally extraordinary story.

“Death Squared: The Explosive Growth and Demise of a Mouse Population.” was published in 1973 by John Calhoun, and it detailed his increasingly bizarre research into the psychological effects of overcrowding. Over two decades he built a series of ‘rodent utopias’, where he could keep a population of rats or mice, meet all their basic food and shelter needs, but mess around with population levels. He wanted to see how they responded to having to live, cheek-by-tiny-jowl, with far more other rats than they were used to. And it wasn’t pretty. Social orders melted into chaos, rodents fought indiscriminately, or shut themselves away at the top of the enclosure. Mating orders collapsed, population numbers tanked, and eventually, every single rat was dead.

His work came at a prescient time. In the 60s and 70s, the exponentially expanding human population was a hot-button topic, and ‘population panic’ was in full swing. Alongside the expansion of cities, creeping urban sprawl, rising city-centre crime rates and 'urban sinks', there grew a concern that human living conditions were about to take an interminable dive. How would we live, with so many of us on earth? Calhoun’s work was leapt on by the press and public as a dire prediction of our own coming collapse. His rodent utopias became a subject of great interest among architects and city planners, psychologists and sociologists, and anyone fascinated by the human condition. But has his work been misunderstood?

50 years on, what lessons can we take from the work of a ground-breaking but often misunderstood scientist, in the face of a human population now exceeding 8 billion. Emily Knight explores his extraordinary work, its implications for humanity, and the possibility of a human utopia, that might not look anything like you expect.

Presented and Produced by Emily Knight in Cardiff

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

BBC Sounds, Music, Radio, podcasts.

0:07.4

I'm Dilley Carter, and I love organising.

0:11.8

In my brand new podcast, sort your life out, unpacked, celebrity guests join me to unbox three revealing items from their home.

0:18.7

Oh, wow. I wasn't expecting this.

0:22.4

Along the way,

0:27.0

I'll be giving you practical hacks to help you declutter your life as well. This is the tough love I need. Don't hold back. I'm definitely tucking you with me back to my house. Sort your life out,

0:32.6

unpacked. Watch on eye player, listen on BBC Sounds.

0:41.9

It's 1958, on a farm in rural Maryland in the USA.

0:47.3

Inside a huge converted barn, a scientist named John B. Calhoun is perched on the perimeter wall of an enormous enclosure, teeming with rats.

0:52.4

He's watching and taking notes.

0:55.2

He cuts a hole so he can look down at this rat population. He films, he takes photographs,

1:03.0

and he allows his population to grow.

1:06.5

Calhoun knows a lot about rats, and he's calculated that there's room in these enclosures

1:10.7

for around 50 of them to live comfortably.

1:13.5

But there's more than that in here.

1:15.4

He's keeping the population steady at 80, slightly too many for comfort.

1:20.0

And he's seeing what happens.

1:21.9

Calhoun started to notice a number of aberrant behaviors among the rats.

1:27.2

Extreme violence, sexual deviance, the breakdown of maternal care.

1:32.5

All sorts of somewhat horrifying behaviors that showed up.

1:37.0

Horrifying, disturbing, you know, surprising.

1:40.1

It really becomes a very brutal environment.

...

Please login to see the full transcript.

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from BBC, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of BBC and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.

Copyright © Tapesearch 2026.